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Active Threads | Active Posts | Unanswered Today | Since Yesterday | This Week
Faith & Theology
05/20/18 01:26 PM
Fr Al,

With respect to your statement about widowed clergy, I seem to recall the case of Fr Joseph Allen of the Antiochian Archdiocese, who was reinstated to the presbyterate by +Metropolitan PHILLIP after Fr Joseph married a woman he had counseled to divorce her husband. Is this an anomaly among the Orthodox Churches or is this an exercise of oikonomia?
6 427 Read More
Faith & Theology
05/20/18 03:55 AM
St John Paul abrogated the canons of affinity by marriage in the Latin Code. They remain in the Eastern Code but I imagine a dispensation may be requested.
6 427 Read More
The Other Sacramental Mysteries
05/18/18 12:52 PM
LaudeturIesus:

Christ is in our midst!!

Welcome to the forum.

You might ask the priest when you go to confession at the Eastern Catholic Church you plan to attend. He will be able to tell you what their particular custom is.

Bob
Moderator
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The Other Sacramental Mysteries
05/18/18 03:37 AM
Hi, I'm new to this forum. I'm a devout, 18 year old, traditional Latin Catholic convert. I plan on going to an Eastern Catholic Divine Liturgy sometime (most likely Ruthenian) and going to confession in the Byzantine Rite beforehand. I might drive to Spokane, Washington or somewhere in Western Oregon.

My question is: how would I receive Holy Communion in the Byzantine Rite as if I was Ruthenian, and the same with confession? I understand that the communicant does not say "Amen," for example, which I would be familiar with anyways since I attend the Extraordinary Form of the Mass by default (1962 Roman Missal).
1 83 Read More
Church News
05/16/18 03:52 PM
If the strike is based on, at best, murky intelligence and corrupt motives, it most certainly is not just. In the case of the alleged attacks in Ghouta, an attack was launched before any solid evidence was obtained. To date, the story has continually gotten murkier, which is why the Western media has largely dropped it. Now they are saying, maybe it wasn't sarin, but chlorine. Or maybe it was both sarin or chlorine. Or maybe it was something else.

There have also been reports of the jihadist "rebels" using chlorine gas. The UN's Carla del Ponte reported evidence that some of these groups had obtained sarin. These inconvenient facts are routinely forgotten or ignored.

Reagan and friends encouraged and even facilitated (with intelligence) Saddam Hussein's use of chemical weapons against the Iranians. So the US has no problem with chemical weapon use when it is to our advantage.

In light of the jihadist groups' propensity to lie and distort, and US intelligence's propensity to magnify these lies for geopolitical aims, it is not only reasonable but a simple duty to meet these reports with skepticism. One thing everyone forgets- the rebels' first allegation of chemical weapon use by the Syrian government turned out to be completely bogus, as the US State Department itself admitted: https://www.brookings.edu/opinions/...t-that-syria-used-a-hallucinogen-weapon/
4 585 Read More
Parish Life & Evangelization
05/15/18 01:14 PM
David, I belonged to that church in Struthers, and was wondering if you have ever completed your research on it and if you have any more history to it than posted here? I knew a lady from the church, Ann Novak, might that be a relative of yours?
8 4,176 Read More
Faith & Theology
05/15/18 12:11 AM
I assume m the child would still technically be Latin rite?
5 206 Read More
Church News
05/15/18 12:06 AM
Originally Posted by lcanthony
Find us one, please. Joined ACROD. New young energetic priest, Father Nick Mihaly. Hopefully the future of eastern clergy. Also a new father, too. Welcome to Erie.


I don't know much about Erie, PA, but San Luis Obispo, CA is ripe for an Eastern Catholic explosion. I think Saint Anne's could easily double or triple in size if it actually reached out to the community in which it is located. I think Fr. Michael might be just the man to lead the charge.

The fact that he's a celibate priest will work in his favor I believe here locally. He'll be able to more easily coordinate with local Latin Rite priests. It really is amazing just how much brighter things look today with Fr. Michael on his way to CA.

One thing is for certain. He's never enjoyed a more temperate summer in his life, than the one he will be enjoying this summer!
9 486 Read More
Church News
05/14/18 11:51 PM
Originally Posted by JLF
To answer your last question, yes, there are three ordained readers in the Eparchy of Passaic, and I'm one of them.

Jack Figel


Thank you, that's really fascinating to me... I guess Phoenix is just trailing a bit. Perhaps one day...
9 486 Read More
Vespers, Matins & the Divine Liturgy
05/14/18 07:10 PM
Yes, I served in the Serbian church about seven years. The gates would be open for "Blessed is the Kingdom", that's the only major difference between them and ROCOR. Also, when my son chanted, Matins preceded the liturgy, so the gates were opened when I censed the church during the Great Doxology.
As for St. Elias, they appear to be more traditional than some ROCOR churches grin.I wouldn't mind a Ukrainian Orthodox parish like that.
3 208 Read More
Vespers, Matins & the Divine Liturgy
05/14/18 07:00 PM
I can't speak for Byzantine Catholic but as for Ukrainian Catholic, which is similar, most churches leave the Royal gates open throughout the whole liturgy. For Presanctified, they are opened for Blessed is the kingdom, closed directly afterwards, opened at joyous light and left open for the the rest of the time. When vespers is served (which is rare, unfortunately) they're opened at joyous light and left open for the rest of vespers, which is the Carpatho Rusyn practice as well, at least for Vespers. The only Ukrainian Catholic church I'm aware of that follows the rubrics with opening and closing the Royal doors is St. Elias. Where I'm from, even the Orthodox churches don't close and open the doors as prescribed, with the exception of the Serbian one. The OCA parish near me, interestingly, leaves the deacons doors open for all forty days, which is a Rusyn practice.
3 208 Read More
Vespers, Matins & the Divine Liturgy
05/14/18 06:45 PM
I serve the classical ROCOR/Russian way; that is, the Royal Gates remain shut until the Little Entrance, are closed again after the Gospel/Homily, open for the Great Entrance. After the Great Entrance, the Royal Gates and curtain close, the curtain is drawn at the start of the Creed. The Gates open for Communion of the Faithful and remain so until the end of the Liturgy. I came across Ukrainian Catholic Rubrics circa 1948, which prescribed this form of serving as well. I don't have them at the present, but I recall the Congregation for Eastern Churches(I think) decreed that in churches where the practice of serving with open Royal Gates existed, this could continue, but forbade it's introduction in those churches where it didn't occur.(For all I know, this decree may no longer be in force).
I learned this way of serving at St. Tikhon's and later Holy Trinity in Jordanville. Naturally, during Bright Week, the Gates and Deacons Doors remain open. Also, during the Paschal period, I open the Gates for "Blessed is the Kingdom and the triple "Christ is Risen!" This coming Tuesday evening and Wednesday morning, I will do Vespers, Matins, and Liturgy as during Bright Week. Is this the usual Byzantine Catholic usage? My parish uses Carpatho Rusyn plain chant, but almost exclusively in English. It is an OCA parish and even the very old don't speak Slovak or "po-nashomu".
3 208 Read More
Faith & Theology
05/14/18 06:23 PM
I am unaware that in Orthodoxy the term "non-sacramental" would ever be used to describe a mystery performed by the church. It is agreed that one marriage is the ideal; hence the widowed priest or deacon may not contract a second marriage and remain in the clergy. Not only am I a widower, but my son, a tonsured Reader age 41, just lost his wife in November after having been married only six months. The Archbishop said that should he remarry, he could remain a Reader without the possibility of advancing to ordination. On the other hand, if he reaches age 45, and at that point is willing to remain celibate, he could then be ordained a deacon.
I have a question on another marriage related subject however. Does Rome allow a widow to marry her late husband's brother? It was required in the Old Testament and Orthodox Judaism still practices this. The Orthodox Church forbids such a marriage. I couldn't even marry my late wife's first cousin(assuming I wasn't a priest and wanted to do such a thing.) Also, in the Orthodox Church, two brothers may not marry two sisters. It is evident that Rome has no such prohibitions' because in the Byzantine Catholic Church near where I grew up, three brothers married three sisters in the early years of the last century!
6 427 Read More
Faith & Theology
05/14/18 12:11 AM
Originally Posted by ajk
Originally Posted by dochawk
Historically, the second marriage, whether after divorce or widowing, is considered nonsacramental,
Is there anything then that remains of the prior sacramental marriage? How is the nonsacramental marriage different, other than being sanctioned by the church, from just living together or a common law marriage?


As I understand it, the notion is that marriage is to be permanent, but that sometimes it quite clearly dies/fails/somethings. Economia is used to permit another marriage in this tragic ; the first appears (to me) to be gone in this case.

The difference from shacking up would be that the situation is not illicit, I suppose.

Originally Posted by dochawk
but with the hope that it will in time become sacramental...
How does this happen?
[/quote]

The prayerfulness of the couple and efforts to be holy and walk with God, I presume.

hawk
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Church News
05/13/18 09:34 PM
There is an ordained Subdeacon in the Eparchy of Phoenix, who is not looking to become a deacon.
9 486 Read More
Faith & Theology
05/13/18 12:31 PM
Originally Posted by dochawk
Historically, the second marriage, whether after divorce or widowing, is considered nonsacramental,
Is there anything then that remains of the prior sacramental marriage? How is the nonsacramental marriage different, other than being sanctioned by the church, from just living together or a common law marriage?

Originally Posted by dochawk
but with the hope that it will in time become sacramental...
How does this happen?
6 427 Read More
Faith & Theology
05/12/18 11:15 PM
Historically, the second marriage, whether after divorce or widowing, is considered nonsacramental, but with the hope that it will in time become sacramental.

Some of the joyful readings and prayers are replaced with penitential.

Modernly, some churches are using the unmodified crowning, though--with some apparently even denying that it is a change.

hawk
6 427 Read More
Faith & Theology
05/12/18 11:11 PM
Yes, they may do this.

Furthermore, they may have the child baptized into the byzantine church, which will be noted on the record.

hawk
5 206 Read More
Church News
05/12/18 11:05 PM
I cannot imagine anything that would meet the notion of a "just war" if the destruction of facilities used to produce chemical weapons and are controlled by those who use them on civilians doesn't qualify . . .

AMDG

hawk
4 585 Read More
Church News
05/12/18 09:32 PM
To answer your last question, yes, there are three ordained readers in the Eparchy of Passaic, and I'm one of them.

Jack Figel
9 486 Read More
Church News
05/11/18 10:41 PM
Originally Posted by The young fogey
[quote=Exegete]...The point of course is the lesson, not how it's read. Ideally a parish has a deacon, subdeacon, and a few men as ordained readers...


Actually, no, that's not true. How well the lesson is read is also of vital importance. In the example I mentioned, a young lady did a superb job of chanting the lesson. She was congratulated by Fr. Michael and the great majority in attendance. There were however a small number of problem people that got upset -- not because she actually read at a Divine Liturgy, but that she was allowed to read during the seminar. This type of problem people are a pox on far too many parishes.

The sad thing in this case is that in place of this young lay potentially reading at a DL, we often have rather poor (male) readers. That's simply just wrong. You note an "ideal" that I'm not sure exists? If there are both competent male and female lay readers available to read for a given DL, I'm not at all sure the male enjoys any sort of any official preference?

Finally, is the Ruthenian Church ordaining men to the subdiaconate and as readers these days?
9 486 Read More
Faith & Theology
05/11/18 01:51 PM
Originally Posted by InquiringByzantine
I wouldn't think it was possible for a Latin Rite family to baptize or chrismate their children in an Eastern Church without first switching officially to the Eastern Church

That's not the case. I think when the pastor at my parish baptizes a child of Latin Catholic parents, he first obtains permission from the Latin Catholic bishop.
5 206 Read More
Church News
05/10/18 09:41 AM
Originally Posted by Exegete
Some difficult people were upset that he pointed out that female readers are acceptable in the Ruthenian Church (presuming they are competent), but he was quite correct and kind in his comments.


I came to Catholicism from Anglicanism so this Novus Ordoism trying to soft-sell the attempted ordination of women is a jab but there are worse things and choose your battles. (Liberal Canada has Ukrainian Catholic parishes with altar girls and lady Eucharistic ministers.) The point of course is the lesson, not how it's read. Ideally a parish has a deacon, subdeacon, and a few men as ordained readers, but the Byzantine Rite Catholic parish I go to is still reviving the use of incense and chant; baby steps. And I don't mind the lay readers of either sex much if they do it right, standing in the nave facing the altar, very liturgical. The parish I go to is slowly weaning the congregation off the Novus Ordoism of the lectern facing the congregation.
9 486 Read More
Church News
05/10/18 09:40 AM
Find us one, please. Joined ACROD. New young energetic priest, Father Nick Mihaly. Hopefully the future of eastern clergy. Also a new father, too. Welcome to Erie.
9 486 Read More
Town Hall
05/09/18 08:51 PM
Please do NOT click on the Dillingen Franciscans website link - that url has been overtaken by a bad site. The blog, Our Franciscan Fiat, is still up and running,
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