The Byzantine Forum
Newest Members
Melkite4Life, son of the desert, chchannel, OrbisNonSufficit, SergLts
5,657 Registered Users
Who's Online Now
1 members (jova), 162 guests, and 143 robots.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Latest Photos
Byzantine Nebraska
Byzantine Nebraska
by orthodoxsinner2, December 11
Church of the Holy Trinity (UGCC) - Brazil
Church of the Holy Trinity (UGCC) - Brazil
by Santiago Tarsicio, March 17
Papal Audience 10 November 2017
Papal Audience 10 November 2017
by JLF, November 10
Upgraded Russian icon corner
Upgraded Russian icon corner
by The young fogey, October 20
Russian Greek Catholic Global Congress
Russian Greek Catholic Global Congress
by likethethief, June 12
Forum Statistics
Forums26
Topics34,879
Posts412,872
Members5,657
Most Online3,380
Dec 29th, 2019
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Page 1 of 4 1 2 3 4
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 564
L
lpreima Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
L
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 564
Hello Everyone and Slava Isusu Khrestu!
This morning at RISU (Ukrainian Information Service of Ukraine), I read an article that said that Patriarch Husar said that Ukraine should accept the Patriarchal visitation of Alexis II to Ukraine and furthermore, Husar said that he would accept him as an honorary guest. This is somewhat confusing, but I guess Husar knows what he's doing, and who said that being a Christian is something easy. I'm pretty sure that a lot of people are going to criticize his actions and comments on this issue. Let me tell you that Husar has guts. I never imagined this, but he has my support anyway.
Lauro

Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 26,173
Member
Offline
Member
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 26,173
Dear Lauro,

What Patriarch Lubomyr has said is only proper and becoming of a true Christian leader.

Besides, Patriarchs must be nice to other Patriarchs, you know! wink

Hopefully, they won't have a beard-pulling contest!

Alex

Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 425
Member
Offline
Member
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 425
Wow! Good move by Husar, because it shows that he is a good man. Patriarch Alexei will probably decline a meeting, which will make him look bad. I hope that doesn't happen.

During the Papal Visit to Ukraine, Patriarch Alexei was constantly making PR msitakes, which in turn made him look bad to world Orthodoxy and Catholics alike. If Husar and Ridiger were to meet then Patriarch Alexei could see what we "Uniates" are really like, i.e. nice people (Hahahah!), and that we don't go around throwing people out of their own churches, or at least not anymore.

Daniil

Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 26,173
Member
Offline
Member
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 26,173
Dear Daniil,

Well, I hope our people don't go around with anti-Alexei placards - like what happened prior to the papal visit there. I'm sure not . . .

I think that our Patriarch should have a guard of honour, you know, like the Swiss Guards.

Perhaps they could be called the "Husars?" wink

When do you think they will canonize Fr. Kostelnyk?

And do you think our Patriarch should attend that, if invited? wink

Alex

Joined: May 2002
Posts: 564
L
lpreima Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
L
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 564
I wonder what certain Ukie bishops are saying from the UGCC, Kyivan Patriarchate, UAOC and Moscow Patriarchate? Do you people think that with his actions and comments he will be respected? I know some hard headed Ukies that I'm pretty sure will want an explanation of his comments. I will say an extra prayer for Husar this evening. He's going to need it and I hope he's got a lot of friends and I mean real friends. I hope everything works out for him and our church.
Lauro

Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 26,173
Member
Offline
Member
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 26,173
Dear Lauro,

The Moscow Patriarch is coming to Ukraine whether Husar, or anyone else, likes it or not.

This is an opportunity for His Holiness the Patriarch to see that not all Ukrainian Catholics, contrary to expectation, have horns, hoofs and a tail.

And that not all of them carry side-arms with bullets marked "Russian Orthodox" on them.

He will also be able to see for himself that Russian Orthodox living in Ukraine do not need to walk around in chains and with signs saying "Schismatic" pasted to their foreheads.

And he will be able to settle forever his lingering suspicions that Russian priests are hung upon gibbets and placed in public stocks in places like L'viv.

And when the Ukrainian government says Ukraine is a country independent of Russia, it really DOES mean that.

Sometimes, one simply has to see for oneself!

Alex

Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 1,716
Member
Offline
Member
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 1,716
God Bless His Beatitude for his invitation and truly Ecumenical gesture!!!

May His Holiness of Moscow and All-Russia accept and may the 2 Patriarchs have a good and charitable talk!

Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 7,461
Member
Offline
Member
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 7,461
I think it is a great Christian move by Patriach Lubomyr. Ironically, it may be the Ukrainian Autocephalous Orthodox and Ukrainian Orthodox Church/Kyivan Patriarchate who are some of his most outspoken critics.

I don't think Patriarch Alexei would accept, it would be much egg on his face considering his tirades with respect to the Greek Catholics and the Catholic Church in general.

Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 26,173
Member
Offline
Member
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 26,173
Dear Diak,

It might be good for the Ukrainian Catholics to see the Moscow Patriarch up close and acknowledge that he also does not have horns, hoofs and a tail.

But some have to see for themselves! smile

Alex

Joined: May 2002
Posts: 2,941
D
djs Offline
Member
Offline
Member
D
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 2,941
Quote
This morning at RISU (Ukrainian Information Service of Ukraine), I read an article that said that Patriarch Husar said that Ukraine should accept the Patriarchal visitation of Alexis II to Ukraine and furthermore, Husar said that he would accept him as an honorary guest.
This sentence was re-posted on the Indiana list, and criticized for its perceived presumptuous tone.

http://listserv.indiana.edu/cgi-bin/wa?A2=ind0211d&L=orthodox&F=&S=&P=4196

The actual English text is available at:
http://www.risu.org.ua/article.php?sid=569&offsets=&l=en

The tone is, IMO, respectful and hopeful. Some excerpts:

Quote
The UGCC recognizes and respects the right of Orthodox Christians in Ukraine, in particular the faithful of the Moscow Patriarchate, to invite and receive those whom they consider their spiritual authorities.
... one can anticipate positive consequences from such a pastoral visit for the faithful of the Moscow Patriarchate and for society as a whole.
... if the Patriarch of Moscow does visit Ukraine, I will be happy to receive him as a distinguished guest...

Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 1,716
Member
Offline
Member
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 1,716
Well, the Indiana List is pretty notorious for it's extremism.

Joined: May 2002
Posts: 2,941
D
djs Offline
Member
Offline
Member
D
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 2,941
The post there was not really extreme, just misinformed.

Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 6,547
Likes: 1
John
Member
Offline
John
Member
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 6,547
Likes: 1
I saw the post on the Indiana list. The poster was misinformed and jumped to an incorrect conclusion. Clearly, Patriarch Husar was speaking pastorally to all Ukrainians of all religions and telling them that they should welcome the pastoral visit of Patriarch Alexis II of Moscow (just as they welcomed Pope John Paul II as an honored guest in their country). Ukraine includes canonical territory for both the MP and Rome.

In the official text (which djs provided the link for), Husar stated:

“We are also not indifferent to the situation that exists in Ukrainian Orthodoxy. Although we have no desire to interfere in matters not our own, nevertheless the problem of mutual conflicts between Christians, particularly our fellow citizens, cannot be a matter that is completely foreign to us. We sincerely hope that the visit of the Moscow Patriarch to Ukraine will be instrumental in mending specific evangelical relations between the three branches of Ukrainian Orthodoxy.

Essentially, Husar is calling upon the various Orthodox groups to work together mending the various problems facing Orthodoxy in Ukraine. He knows that a strong and united Orthodox Church in Ukraine is an asset for the Church’s witness of Christ to the Ukrainian people. He also that healing within Orthodoxy must happen before healing between East and West can happen. I am beginning to appreciate Husar’s wisdom more and more.

Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 268
FAW Offline
Member
Offline
Member
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 268
It will be very interesting to observe the MP's reaction and whether they are willing to meet with Patriarch Lubomyr to discuss the following issues:
Quote

“Therefore, if the Patriarch of Moscow does visit Ukraine, I will be happy to receive him as a distinguished guest: in order to move from stalemate to resolution of an entire list of issues regarding our mutual relations: the peaceful coexistence of Greek Catholics and Orthodox in the contemporary circumstances of Ukraine; an appraisal of the Lviv pseudo-synod of 1946; the resolution of church property issues; as well as the situation of Ukrainian Greek Catholics living on the territory of the Russian Federation, since we would like to ensure that they be able to enjoy the same rights as all the faithful, both Catholic and Orthodox, enjoy in Ukraine."
The leadership I am seeing from Patriarch Lubomyr is, well, very fitting for a patriarch, and a holy one at that.

How the MP responds is very important. The ball is in their court. If they refuse, then I think that there can be little doubt the ROC is a church that cannot be taken seriously, ecumenically or institutionally, at this point. If they accept, which I predict they will, then it is possible that the churches can all begin to take steps forward towards healing. One of the first steps for the ROC, is to accept the legitimate existence of the UGCC.

With response to the Indiana group comment: whether done with misinformation, or not, the ignorance and obvious hatred of the person writing is more apparent than anything else. Can anyone who talks like this really be taken seriously? :rolleyes:

ALity

Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 26,173
Member
Offline
Member
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 26,173
Dear Friends,

The Patriarch mentioned "three branches" of Ukrainian Orthodoxy.

I understand there is a story on CWNEWS today that mentions a fourth.

Does anyone know anything about it?

Alex

Page 1 of 4 1 2 3 4

Moderated by  Father Anthony 

Link Copied to Clipboard
The Byzantine Forum provides message boards for discussions focusing on Eastern Christianity (though discussions of other topics are welcome). The views expressed herein are those of the participants and may or may not reflect the teachings of the Byzantine Catholic or any other Church. The Byzantine Forum and the www.byzcath.org site exist to help build up the Church but are unofficial, have no connection with any Church entity, and should not be looked to as a source for official information for any Church. All posts become property of byzcath.org. Contents copyright - 1996-2020 (Forum 1998-2020). All rights reserved.
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.5