Well...

http://www.ewtn.com/vnews/getstory.asp?number=64726

james

Do you think that the Pope and the Patriarch could use this meeting as some kind of announcement on cooperation, communion, etc. Is this the start of something big or a non-issue?

I would guess the latter, I doubt that without the support of all the other Eastern Orthodox churches that Bartholomew I would simply annouce such a thing. Still, it is nice that they can sit down with one another and talk civily. I cant recall but I'm sure someone else will, has a Pope ever been to Constantinople since it fell to the Turks?

Both Paul VI and John Paul II visited the Ecumenical Patriarchate - so far as I am aware these are the only known occasions of a Pope attending the Eucharist celebrated by a Church with which the Pope is not in communion.

I would suspect that the Turkish government suddenly agreed to issue the invitation in an attempt to regain some standing after the murder of the priest the other day. It would be rather nice if the Pope did visit Trebizon.

Incognitus

I would suspect that the Turkish government suddenly agreed to issue the invitation in an attempt to regain some standing after the murder of the priest the other day. It would be rather nice if the Pope did visit Trebizon.

Incognitus
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Bingo...

james

incognitus:

Didn't the late Pope John Paul II attend the Liturgy served by Catholicos Patriarch Karekin II when he made his visit to Armenia?

I seem to recall--even if this were not the case--that he was invited to celebrate the Liturgy at the Catholicos Patriarch's altar in the seat of Armenian Christianity--seems to me that this latter event was the first time a Pope had celebrated at an altar of a Church not in communion.

In Christ,

BOB

I thought the Turkish Government had issued their invitation some time ago but it has taken a while to sort out a date. The poor old Patriarchate can't seem to do anything right in the eye of their government. It will be interesting how many of the Papal party do the visit in collar and tie.

Holy new martyr priest Andrew, of Trabzon, pray to God for us!

Was there an Orthodox Liturgy during Pope John Paul II's visit to Romania? I thought that Patriarch Theoctist did *some* service with the Pope attending, but I don't remember if it was a Liturgy or not.

Dave

I stand corrected (well, all right, I'm actually sitting at the computer); the Patriarch did celebrate the Divine Liturgy in Bucharest in the presence of the Pope.

Incognitus

But when will the patriarchs of Rome and Moscow meet?!? After all - The Third Rome is the biggest orthodox local church...

Glory to Jesus Christ!

Ever since the historic meeting between Pope Paul VI and Patriarch Athenagora I in 1964, there has been steps toward recommunion of the two Churches.

The Ecumenical Patriarch sends a high level delegation to Rome for the June 29 celebration of the Feast of Peter and Paul (founders of the Church at Rome) each year. In the spirit of brotherhood, the Holy Father sends a high level delegation to the Phanar for the November 30 celebration of the Feast of St. Andrew (founder of the Church at Constantinople).

This past year, Cardinal Kaspar, Chairman of the Pontifical Council, led the delegation from Rome for the celebration of the liturgy and was graciously afforded a prominent location.

We are not there yet. The ideal location for the visiting delegation is, of course, inside the iconostas. But in the firm words of Ukrainian Orthodox Archbishop Vsevolod, who has been an active participant in the annual Orientale Lumen Conferences in Washington DC each year, he calls for “One chalice…”.

May this visit by the Holy Father bring us closer.

Deacon El

Dear Friends,

With respect to ending the schism between East and West, from the Orthodox side, the only way this will happen is when Rome rejoins Orthodoxy.

I hope that's not a caricature of the Orthodox position, but I don't know how else to express it.

Alex

Security is going to be nightmare with this visit. HH is a braver man than I.

ICXC
NIKA

In my experience that's a pretty standard belief.

Andrew

Pavel if Papa Bene dies then he will have confirmed what I always thought of him: He has ever been a man willing to give up everything for Our Lord and Saviour. As it should be...

Dear Pavel you said:

" It will be interesting how many of the Papal party do the visit in collar and tie."

I say:

I believe in Turkey no one is allowed to wear clerical attire. I don't know if there are different rules for visiting clerics.

If anything should happen to the Pope, (heaven forbid), it would really 'shock' the world into reality. I love this Pope, he is so sweet. Hopefully nothing will happen. But he's placing himself in God's hand. I could say the hands of NATO...but my gosh, the Europeans are so secular. Are they any better than the Turks.

Then again, maybe these outrages against Catholic clerics might make Turkey at least try to show the EU a better side by giving more license to the Patriarchate. I doubt it though.

Then again if the prophecies of Malachy are correct, this pope is the last one mentioned...that is before Pope Peter (the Roman?). Then what?

Zenovia

Then what Zenovia? Then war of course one we'll lose. You're right in your estimation of Europeans. If the Turks are bad then we're worse. Turn a blind eye to anything that doesn't agree with the secular agenda e.g. the plight of Christians in 'certain nations'.

Yes all clergy (except the 2 Patriarchs who have been granted a licence to wear their cassocks in public) wear civies when in public. It will be interesting to see what the Popes party will wear on the visit. Those who have checked the pics from HRM will see a group photo of Orthodox Metropolitans out with Bishop John and Igumen Nicholas and all are in lay clothes. The rules in regard to religious dress applies to all religions in Turkey. When Pope John was Nuncio to Turkey he wore a tie. There is a dressing room in the Phanar for visiting clergy to dress up in and put their lay street clothes on after an audience with HH.

I just saw this post and all I can write is that I pray for the day when this scandalous schism comes to an end. I hope this meeting will be the start of the process of a reunification council. "1000" years of separation is "1000" years too long.