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An Eastern Pope? #116053 04/04/05 04:56 AM
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Ex Nihilo Offline OP
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Greetings Brothers & Sisters in Christ,

I would like to get your thoughts on a question I have been pondering the last couple of days. How would relations between the Catholic Church and the Orthodox Churches be affected if by some grace of God the Holy Spirit inspired the cardinals to elect an Eastern Catholic to the papacy? Do you think it would help or hinder ecumenical relations?

I look forward to reading your replies.

Pax Christi.

Re: An Eastern Pope? #116054 04/04/05 04:59 AM
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I doubt that it would help. Many Orthodox would think such an election was a Trojan Horse, I believe.

Dan L

Re: An Eastern Pope? #116055 04/04/05 10:18 AM
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Halychanyn Offline
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Dear Ex Nihilo:

Funny you should ask. The AP is quoting Fr. Thomas Reese of America magazine as saying that Patriarch Lubomyr Husar of the UGCC is a "dark horse" for the Papacy.

Electing a Pope from an Eastern Rite could have but one misson - reconcilliation with the Orthodox. That, IMHO, is premature.

The better course, I respectfully submit, would be to follow through with the notion of "decentralization." Show the Orthodox that Rome is willing to let local Churches/Bishops function with greater autonomy than they have in the past, and one might just see some ecumenical inroads.

Yours,

hal

Re: An Eastern Pope? #116056 04/04/05 11:31 AM
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Carson Daniel Offline
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Hal,

Perhaps. But looking at what the American Bishops have done with that autonomy doesn't inspire much confidence, does it?

Dan L

Re: An Eastern Pope? #116057 04/04/05 12:23 PM
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francis Offline
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I was reading the Washington Post yesterday, and they had a list of a few "papable" cardinals (I know, I know..."he who walks in a pope leaves a cardinal"). What I found interesting is that they listed Cardinal Schoenborn of Vienna, and the top thing they listed about him is his desire for rapproachment with the Eastern Churches. I have admired him for a while for other reasons, but I didn't know that was a top priority for him.

Is it okay to root for a certain cardinal? smile

Re: An Eastern Pope? #116058 04/04/05 01:02 PM
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KO63AP Offline
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Quote
Originally posted by Dan Lauffer:
Hal,

Perhaps. But looking at what the American Bishops have done with that autonomy doesn't inspire much confidence, does it?

Dan L
Dan,

I *think* Hal may be referring to letting the 'other' Churches in communion with the See of Rome to act as such - independent Churches joined in communion, not subdivisions of the Roman Church. IMHO it would also help if these Churches reclaimed their rights and didn't wait to be told be Rome that they can act on their own (except in matters of faith - this is to be discussed only in Council).

Just my 0.02 of the local currency.

Σώσον, Κύριε, καί διαφύλαξον ηάς από τών Βασιλιάνικων τάξεων!

Re: An Eastern Pope? #116059 04/04/05 01:07 PM
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Father Gregory Offline
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Francis, CHRIST IS RISEN---AND DWELLS IN OUR VERY MIDST! I don't think we're allowed to 'root' for a particular candidate, rather, we are to 'root' for the will of the Holy Spirit. wink Now, I suppose it's OK for you to 'root-in-prayer' to the Holy Spirit that your candidate might be considered...but that's probably the most we should do. Remember, God is capable of bringing good even out of evil...so He can certainly use anyone and anything to bring about his purpose.

I enjoyed your comment though...a good sense of humor is so very important, and the way you expressed yourself was so humble and gentle...that it moved me.

Much love to you!

In the Risen One,
+Fr. Gregory


+Father Archimandrite Gregory, who asks for your holy prayers!
Re: An Eastern Pope? #116060 04/04/05 01:14 PM
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Carson Daniel Offline
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Quote
Originally posted by KO63AP:
Quote
Originally posted by Dan Lauffer:
[b] Hal,

Perhaps. But looking at what the American Bishops have done with that autonomy doesn't inspire much confidence, does it?

Dan L
Dan,

I *think* Hal may be referring to letting the 'other' Churches in communion with the See of Rome to act as such - independent Churches joined in communion, not subdivisions of the Roman Church. IMHO it would also help if these Churches reclaimed their rights and didn't wait to be told be Rome that they can act on their own (except in matters of faith - this is to be discussed only in Council).

Just my 0.02 of the local currency.

Σώσον, Κύριε, καί διαφύλαξον ηάς από τών Βασιλιάνικων τάξεων! [/b]
I certainly concur with that.

CDL

Re: An Eastern Pope? #116061 04/04/05 02:19 PM
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susiefreckleface Offline
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Christ is Risen!

Hello all,

Quote
I don't think we're allowed to 'root' for a particular candidate, rather, we are to 'root' for the will of the Holy Spirit. [Wink] Now, I suppose it's OK for you to 'root-in-prayer' to the Holy Spirit that your candidate might be considered...but that's probably the most we should do. Remember, God is capable of bringing good even out of evil...so He can certainly use anyone and anything to bring about his purpose.
Very nicely said Fr. - We need to allow our bodies to be the conduit for the Holy Spirit especially in our mindful prayers. It is very much to 'know' that Our Eternal Father IS capable of bringing good... still an old American saying comes to mind, "be careful of what you ask for... you just might get it." Just to say even Adam fell and he actually walked with Him in the garden.

Reverting back to my usual + positive [could be a pun here people - keep reading] self... I use this analogy for prayer to some people on occasion. Think of your body more of as a capacitor (ie. condenser) - and not the coppertop battery. We get, and give of the Holy Spirit... with every pulse of our breath that IS of the Holy Spirit... be a conduit of His will, and acknowledge that we are not a battery. I know I have NO power of my own making. Believe me HE reminds me of this [sometimes ad-nausium it seems].

And since it's baseball season I say root-root-root for the Home team. Yep - that would be the Holy Spirit.

toodles & God bless, sUSAn
arrogant arch sinner

Re: An Eastern Pope? #116062 04/04/05 02:35 PM
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Why not? There have been 8 Eastern Popes in the past.

Re: An Eastern Pope? #116063 04/04/05 03:51 PM
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Halychanyn Offline
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Dear Mike:

It could happen. However, one must look at it from the perspective of "what will it achieve?" I suppose it would also depend which "Easterner" one is considering.

Yours,

hal

Re: An Eastern Pope? #116064 04/04/05 04:01 PM
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Dear Dan and Kobzar:

Allow me to clarify. When I speak of de-centralization, I speak in the most general terms possible.

This includes both allowing the Eastern Churches to be truly sui juris and, also granting local Western Rite Bishops greater lattitude in governance at the national and local levels.

As for Dan's point about the American bishops, it's probably a "glass half empty - glass half full" situation - it all depends upon how each of us looks at it individually.

Yours,

hal

Re: An Eastern Pope? #116065 04/04/05 06:18 PM
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wild goose Offline
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Quote
Originally posted by Dan Lauffer:
Hal,

Perhaps. But looking at what the American Bishops have done with that autonomy doesn't inspire much confidence, does it?

Dan L
Theological geography has a lot to do with how "the American Bishops" have exercised autonomy, don't you think Dan? Most any faith group based on the American continent (perhaps Australia as well) is going to be a bit more maverick than any other place on the planet! LOL

Little history and culture -- little appreciation of the strength of Tradition. Catholics in the Far East have as long a history as Catholics on the North American continent... and they are in many ways closer to Rome (and Byzantium) philosophically and spiritually.

The Western Church, not primarily the Catholic Tradition, in Europe, from which many offshoots have grown, has some answers to give. Having said that, a Methodist friend of mine seems to think Catholicism (Western) is growing leaps and bounds where he lives (even with the recent scandals filling the headlines).

Karol was Polish... Eastern European; maybe the Cardinals will think/pray/look even further East (or South) this time round. God bless them, wg

Re: An Eastern Pope? #116066 04/04/05 08:52 PM
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rcguest Offline
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Quote


Perhaps. But looking at what the American Bishops have done with that autonomy doesn't inspire much confidence, does it?

Dan L [/QB]
Dan,

Please don't paint with such a broad brush all the time.

America is a big, big country. There are many Bishops, Religious, and Faithful who DO follow the directives of the Pope (Memory Eternal!) and the Magisterium. The Roman Catholic Church in the United States is not an autonomous or particular Church, although I will acknowledge there are some bishops who think it is. If everything was absolutely perfect we would all be already present in the glory of our Almighty God.

In Christ, Bill

Re: An Eastern Pope? #116067 04/04/05 09:08 PM
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Logos - Alexis Offline
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Maybe, as Father Gregory said, it's not exactly proper to "root" for a certain candidate, but I think we should all be able to pray to God and express what we desire in the next Holy Father, through the Will of the Holy Spirit.

But if I were rooting, I'd be rooting for Bishop Rifan of Campos, Brazil...but he's not a cardinal. In terms of actual papabili, I would prefer either Cardinal Tettamanzi (of Milan) or Cardinal Arinze. Patriarch Husar would be an incredible boost for Eastern Catholic recognition throughout the world...really just for Eastern Christian recognition throughout the world. I'd pay a million bucks to see the expression on Patriarch Alexy's face when he learned of Patriarch Husar's election! The two drawbacks to Husar that I see are: 1) might not be able to work out the internal problems of the Roman Catholic Church, and 2.) probably would negatively affect relations with the Eastern Orthodox.

Heck, anyone but Cardinal Danneels of Belgium.

Let us offer fervent and heartfelt prayers for the repose of the soul of our Most Holy Father, John Paul II, and for the Holy Spirit to work His Will unhindered in the election of John Paul's successor.

Logos Teen

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