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Orthodox/CAtholic Prayer #154155 03/23/03 07:32 PM
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Gideon Offline OP
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I've been taught not to pray with Catholics by Orthodox Priests and laity, how do Eastern Catholics feel about the idea of not praying with the "Heterodox?"


Abba Isidore the Priest:
When I was younger and remained in my cell I set no limit to prayer; the night was for me as much the time of prayer as the day.
(p. 97, Isidore 4)
Re: Orthodox/CAtholic Prayer #154156 03/23/03 07:49 PM
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Brother Gideon,

I am a Catholic of the Roman Rite, a tradionalist at heart, yet I will pray with my brethern no matter if they are of any Orthodox Rite,Melkite, Greek etc. In fact when I pray I use Eastern Orthodox,Byzantine & Melkite Catholic, and some of my own Rite. I myself do not see any problem.

In Christ,
James

Re: Orthodox/CAtholic Prayer #154157 03/23/03 08:11 PM
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Gideon Offline OP
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Br. James,

Have you heard of this teaching before?

Is it ok to prayer with people who are not Christians?

Does this make the statement "it doesn't matter what you believe, our prayers will reach God?"

Is Jesus Christ "the narrow Gate" Matt. 7?

sinner, Gideon


Abba Isidore the Priest:
When I was younger and remained in my cell I set no limit to prayer; the night was for me as much the time of prayer as the day.
(p. 97, Isidore 4)
Re: Orthodox/CAtholic Prayer #154158 03/23/03 10:28 PM
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Two Lungs Offline
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Quote
Originally posted by Gideon:
I've been taught not to pray with Catholics by Orthodox Priests and laity. . .
I think I have heard of this before. But, how do they square this with the idea of "praying without ceasing"?

ISTM that one needs to pray at least in the presence of ALL people, and FOR all people, even the heterodox, undox, contradox, antidox, etc.

Otherwise aren't you giving up on the "One, Holy, Catholic, and Apostolic Church" part of the Creed?

Aren't you copping out on the "preach the Gospel to all nations" part of Christianity?

The Lord did NOT say "upon these pebbles, I will scatter the fragments of My Church."

John
Pilgrim and Odd Duck

Re: Orthodox/CAtholic Prayer #154159 03/23/03 10:40 PM
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Our Lady's slave Offline
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I know I'm not James - but I also am Latin and my reaction to the suggestion that we should not pray together - is frankly -- Bunkum.

Think of the Prayer that all Christians use - The Lord's Prayer - should we not say it together ?

The Hail Mary - slight variations in word here - but basically the same prayer .

The Creed - [ well ignoring the question of the Filioque]
it's the same - and yes it's not a prayer but a declaration of our belief.

I am always stunned when I see how much of the Divine Liturgy is familiar .

I know I'm paraphrasing now - but Christ said that when you pray - and then he went on to give us the Lord's Prayer - did He then go on to say - but you can't say it with Orthodox Christians , or Protestants or Oriental Orthodox Christians etc - or did He ?

What do I use in my own Prayer Life - well if I say I have a Jordanville Prayer Book and I do use it as well as the incredible Akathists that have been written by one of our own members - and I attend Divine Liturgy as often as is possible .

Oh before I get too hot under the collar - I rest my case.

Anhelyna

Re: Orthodox/CAtholic Prayer #154160 03/23/03 10:57 PM
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Gideon Offline OP
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Quote
Originally posted by Two Lungs:
Quote
Originally posted by Gideon:
[b] I've been taught not to pray with Catholics by Orthodox Priests and laity. . .
I think I have heard of this before. But, how do they square this with the idea of "praying without ceasing"?

ISTM that one needs to pray at least in the presence of ALL people, and FOR all people, even the heterodox, undox, contradox, antidox, etc.

Otherwise aren't you giving up on the "One, Holy, Catholic, and Apostolic Church" part of the Creed?

Aren't you copping out on the "preach the Gospel to all nations" part of Christianity?

The Lord did NOT say "upon these pebbles, I will scatter the fragments of My Church."

John
Pilgrim and Odd Duck [/b]
Iím sorry for not expressing the question better. So let me try again.

If the Pope and a shaman pray together for world peace the shaman (who rejects the teaching of the catholic Church) prays to a different god (like in Assisi). Are we to believe that their prayers will be answered when they do not hold the Faith God delivered?

If their prayers are answered by God then we need not the catholic church, any faith will do.

This has no effect on prayer for those outside the Church, or praying in the company of non-believers or praying without ceasing.

By praying with those who do not hold the Christian Faith are we not telling them that their Faith is an equal revelation to ours?

Do we deny the uniqueness of Christ and His Church?


Abba Isidore the Priest:
When I was younger and remained in my cell I set no limit to prayer; the night was for me as much the time of prayer as the day.
(p. 97, Isidore 4)
Re: Orthodox/CAtholic Prayer #154161 03/23/03 11:00 PM
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Gideon Offline OP
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Quote

I know I'm paraphrasing now - but Christ said that when you pray - and then he went on to give us the Lord's Prayer - did He then go on to say - but you can't say it with Orthodox Christians , or Protestants or Oriental Orthodox Christians etc - or did He ?

[/QB]
Christ was speaking to His Church, was he not? So we not keep in mind that their are Christians that are not "in" or apart of His Church?


Abba Isidore the Priest:
When I was younger and remained in my cell I set no limit to prayer; the night was for me as much the time of prayer as the day.
(p. 97, Isidore 4)
Re: Orthodox/CAtholic Prayer #154162 03/24/03 04:02 AM
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Two Lungs Offline
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Dear Gideon,

Thank you for clarifying your original post. I think that if we pray with non-Christians, the Lord will be examining our hearts to see what we mean, not just what we say and what we do. He may well fulfill the prayer, according to His judgment, but for His own purpose.


Quote
Originally posted by Gideon:
By praying with those who do not hold the Christian Faith are we not telling them that their Faith is an equal revelation to ours?

Do we deny the uniqueness of Christ and His Church?
The clergy you originally cited appear to believe that the Roman Catholics and their "Uniate" sidekicks are equivalent to the heathens, pagans, and cultists.

This says something much different from stating that Orthodoxy is Church and one does not know whether anything else is within the Church.

Obviously there are those who profess belief in Jesus Christ who ignore or distort basic parts of the faith. But are they pagans? I think not. We will never be able to be one Church, if we cannot find time and place to ask God to help us, together.

John
Pilgrim and Odd Duck


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