Dear Matthew,

Unfortunately, you are correct in that.

Thank you for confirming my ideas about the threat of Islam.

In Christ our Lord and Saviour,
Alice

I saw this after posting an article in Town Hall.
http://www.byzcath.org/bboard/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=8;t=001560;p=1#000000

It is an interesting self-criticsim of Islam.

Thank you, Alice. Its Decaf, LOL!


Matthew-
What does Islam consider a sin that Christianity does not, and vice versa?
They seem to place a strong emphasis on repentance, if the pardoning of terrorists by Saudi and Iraq is any indicator.

Thanks,
Marya

I'm going against this thread. The enemy is not Islam. The enemy is fanaticism.

If we use the Ku Klux Klan as the orthodoxy of Christianity what does that make us Christians?
In that case we are the racist, imperialists, cross burning murderers.

There are one billion Muslims. Most are peaceful people. All it took was a few of them to cause the 9/11 tragedy. The few really bad guys need to be sniffed out and brought to civil justice or bullet justice.

The fanatics have declared their holy war, let's not make the terrible mistake of a war of genocide against Muslims.

Paul

Dear Marya,

What?

I disagree with everything that you have said which is incorrect since it is not the teaching of the Orthodox and Catholic Church.

Your quotes;

"My point is that each group has made God into what THEY want."

"It seems like rather than define one God we have made God into our own images. God is in MY hand, rather than I am in God's hand."

No, we who are of the Orthodox and Catholic faith have not made God to what we want. The Holy Trinity is the Holy Trinity and Truth is Truth.

What you have said is so wrong and incorrect I don't even know where to start. It may seem to be nice of Alice to agree with you but if she is sincere in agreeing with you then she is contributing to world wide insanity as well.

Christians can't just believe whatever they want to make friends. As far as the Patriarch or any Orthodox and Catholic Hierarch is concerned they are wiser then you.

In Christ,

Matthew Panchisin

Dear Matthew,

OFCOURSE, I didn't mean Christians with fullness of truth are insane!!

The insanity *I* meant (and I assumed Marya also meant) is: Islam thinks it is right and Christians are infidels...

Evangelicals think Orthodox are pagans because we 'worship' icons and don't adhere to 'sola scriptura'...Catholics are crazy because they pray to Mary, etc., etc., etc.

and the list goes on....

It is late and I am tired, and I think, (or hope) that you understand what I mean...this is a crazy world full of alot of crazy people who insist that they are right and everyone else is wrong, and because of it anomosity towards our brethren who are also created in the image of God, reigns....

I am sure that is what Marya meant as well, or atleast that is what I understood?
(We females are emotional creatures, and sometimes we read things in each other that the male gender doesn't get! )

If not, I ask forgiveness for interjecting from both of you...

But since you brought my name into it I had to make sure that I didn't scandalize you with what wasn't meant at all!

It is late.... so I wish you a very good night, and every blessing of our Saviour,
An Orthodox sister in Christ...
Alice

Matthew-

My question to you was simply "What do Muslims consider a sin that Christians don't and vice versa" based on your post. I wasn't aware there was a difference in what we both consider a sin.

As for who knows better and the fact that I am wrong- I sincerely apologize to you Matthew. Obviously my post freaked you out. I was thinking out loud in response to another post on solutions. By 'we' I mean we as human beings, not Orthodox or Catholic.


Thank you Alice !

Marya

PRIDE AND ANGER

If Islam truly was a religion of peace, it's adherents would not tolerate the persecution of Christians and others in places like Sudan, Indonesia, Pakistan and Saudi Arabia.

If the definition of a "peaceful" religion includes the concepts of an eternal holy war against Jews and Christians, then one could suppose islam is quite peaceful....(hmmmm) :rolleyes:

Sadly, a billion+ people could be wrong in thier beliefs. Satan is definitely working overtime on this front.

In the long view of history, the islamic nations, particularly those of the middle east, will be painted with a very dark brush for their actions.

2 John: 7-13 (the apostle)

just my .00000000002 cents

Steve

Dear Marya,

I guess we ladies do read each other correctly!

I understood that you were 'thinking out loud' and that you were not in any way infering that Christianity did not hold the TRUTH of the ages...

I wonder why some men get so angry sometimes?

Maybe it is because we are from Earth and they are from Mars????? LOL!

*(Disclaimer to my beloved Orthodox brothers: this is a JOKE...I am not espousing heretical thoughts about alien life )

With love for all brethren on this forum,
in Jesus Christ our Lord and Saviour,
Alice

Alice! Good to see you on the forum!

Yes, we men need to step back sometimes from some of our opinions that are more informed by machismo then real thought
I am glad we have you and the other women on the forum to provide a balance and to tell us to think differently about some subjects!!!

Amen, Paul (paromer). The enemy is fanaticism and extreme nationalism which have caused so much oppression to people of all religions!

LOLOL!!! WOW! Wouldn't THAT throw a wrench into the whole works!
Women do think differently, Alice. I think its a *good* thing. Maybe our Islamic brothers figured this out a long time ago- hence the burkas to keep our thoughts/facial expressions to ourselves,LOL!!

I believe that from what I have read in this thread that some confusion exists in terms of reality and reasonable thoughts and suggest that consideration is given to this matter from an Orthodox Christian perspective. I further think that deflecting and reducing mans God given ability to reason into the realm of quotes like Brian's " Yes, we men need to step back sometimes from some of our opinions that are more informed by machismo then real thought" is ridiculous.

This notion was the result of Alice's quote that sounds ok to accept for excuse purposes relative to any disagreement between sexes, but I think it can hinder any discussion between men and women, men and men or women and women. "We females are emotional creatures, and sometimes we read things in each other that the male gender doesn't get!"

Having said all that, is not the evil one strengthen by the passions of men? Is not confessing and believing that Jesus Christ is the Son of God and teaching something other than that a sin and a heresy in the most extreme way. The Koran denies that Christ is the Son of God and teaches its followers many heresies. That is more than just a typical individual passion that is struggled with. We know that the passions are what strengthen the devil, so how are they weaken or destroyed when the belief system of Islam serves them and promotes them to people who are willing to be deceived? There is no need to assist the liar with promoting his lies knowingly or unknowing.

St Maximus the Confessor tell us the following; "The demons become weak when through the commandments the passions are diminished in us. And they perish when finally they are obliterated through detachment of soul, since they no longer find anything by which they might gain and do battle against it. And this is surely the meaning of 'They shall be weakened and perish before thy face."

In Christ,

Matthew Panchisin