I have been "lurking" on this forum for a little while, but now I'll stop that to share a little piece of news.

I found out last night that the much-revered Pochaev Icon of the Mother of God will be coming to Saint Tikhon's Monastery in South Canaan, Pennsylvania for the annual Memorial Day Weekend Otpust/Pilgrimage.

This will be a wonderful blessing for everyone who is able to be present!

-David M. Mastroberte
Website: Slava Iisusu Christu!

[ 04-05-2002: Message edited by: Chtec ]

[ 04-08-2002: Message edited by: Chtec ]

[ 04-08-2002: Message edited by: Chtec ]

Oh please would anyone who is going say a prayer for me . How wonderful to be there and see that Icon

Christ Is Risen!!

I love the icon of Our Lady of Pochaev!! It is a dream of mine to make a pilgrimage to the monastery in Pochaev.

I do have a question though. Will this be in fact the original icon of Our Lady of Pochaev or a "pilgrim" copy of the icon? I don't see how the monks would want to let the miraculous icon leave the monastery to go out of Ukraine.

Thank you and God bless you!

Truly, He is risen!

It will be the original Icon from the Pochaev Lavra. As Fr. Michael Dahulich, administrative dean of St. Tikhon's Seminary, explained at a lecture he gave last night at my church, the Russian Orthodox Church and the Ukrainian government have both given their approval for the icon to travel to the US.

Give us back the icon!!!
And while you're at it, give us back Pochaev, too. You don't need it. It's too baroque and Basilian for the Russian Orthodox Church anyway.

Please take back the above comments with good
humo(u)r. Pochaev is one of the nicest churches I have ever been in. I was there for services on the feast of the Universal Exaltation of the Cross, and, let me tell you, it was out of the world. I understood what Vladimir's messengers meant when they said they "knew not if they were in heaven or on earth." It is an incredible place. Hopefully we all can visit it someday, and if not, then definately go to St. Tikhon's to venerate the miraculous icon.

Daniil

[ 04-08-2002: Message edited by: Daniil ]

< tongue in cheek >

Very true, Daniil, much too Baroque for a Russian Orthodox church, with all those statues and western icons and what not... but, since the Eastern Catholics are called to be faithful to their liturgical heritage, it's much too Latinized for their use as well. Hmm, whatever shall we do!

I guess the only solution is to give it to me for use as my private chapel, since all that Baroque/Latin stuff doesn't bother me at all.

< / tongue in cheek >

According to our recent instructions FROM ROME.

Quote:

... it's much too Latinized for their use as well. Hmm, whatever shall we do!

I guess the only solution is to give it to me for use as my private chapel, since all that Baroque/Latin stuff doesn't bother me at all.

< / tongue in cheek >

It is, of course, just my opinion, but I think we are not Roman and not Orthodox, but we are us!


Christ is Risen Indeed!

John
Pilgrim and Odd Duck

What great news! But if anyone can't make it to St Tikhon's for Memorial Day but a trip thru the Pennsylvania coal regions you can stop in my home parish, Nativity of the Theotokos (St Mary's) Russian Orthodox Church in Coaldale, Pennsylvania.
There is an EXACT DUPLICATE of it in the parish I grew up in. Even to the jewel encrusted starburst that the Icon is encased in.
St Mary's is also a beautiful church inside to visit.

OrthoMan

Yeah, I hope I don't make you feel bad, but there are about a few hundred exact duplicates around the world. However, they are good to have. Is Coaldale near Olyphant?

Daniil

[ Is Coaldale near Olyphant? ]

Not that far up. Closer to Hazleton & Pottsville and next to Tamaqua.

I hate to be a stickler but the proper spelling should be Pochayiv, as it is pronounced in Ukrainian. Pochaev is Russian. At one time the monastery was a Basilian Greek Catholic monastery, but now its Russian Orthodox (MP)
-ukrainiancatholic

Dear UC,

Not only was the Pochayiv monastery Basilian (the time period in which it got all those Baroque accoutrements), but the Icon was actually crowned with a papal crown amidst throngs of Latin and Greek Catholic clergy and bishops!

In addition, the Basilians actually introduced the Cause of the canonization of St Job of Pochayiv at Rome! They promoted his cult at Pochayiv (that was impossible to stop) and Ilarion Ohienko in his book on Pochayiv cites copies of letters from the Basilian Archimandrite in Pochayiv to Rome about the Cause that was later dropped once the Lavra came back into Orthodox hands.

Catholic medals of the icon of Pochayiv, and I have in my possession one, also have the icon of St Job of Pochayiv on the back.

St Job was canonized by the Ukrainian Orthodox Metropolitan Dionysius Balaban. And my wife is a direct relation to him!

God bless,

Alex

{In addition, the Basilians actually introduced the Cause of the canonization of St Job of
Pochayiv at Rome! They promoted his cult at Pochayiv (that was impossible to stop) and Ilarion Ohienko in his book on Pochayiv cites copies of letters from the Basilian Archimandrite in Pochayiv to Rome about the Cause that was later dropped once the Lavra came back into Orthodox hands.
Catholic medals of the icon of Pochayiv, and I have in my possession one, also have the icon of St Job of Pochayiv on the back.}

I find this fascinating to say the least. Since St Job was one of the staunchest fighters against the Unia. He organized brotherhoods and printing presses to fight it. He also fought for the return of Poachev to Orthodox hands.

If true, what this indicates is just how little the average laity & lower clergy understood what had happened and the fact that they indeed, were no longer members of the Orthodox faith.

[Our venerable father Job was born about 1571 to the Zhelezo family in Volynia (Southwestern Ukraine) and was baptized John. Having wisdom and piety beyond his years, John zealously entered the Ugoinitsky Monastery at the age of ten. He was tonsured exactly two years later with the new name Job. At the age of 30 he was ordained a priest, and shortly thereafter was tonsured into the great and angelic schema. He was then given the task of overseeing the Holy Cross monastery at Dubno. This was a difficult time for the Orthodox in a land so close to Catholic Poland. A false union of the Eastern Orthodox and Roman Catholic churches was declared in 1596. St. Job was a fearless defender of Orthodoxy, and under his direction, many Orthodox books were distributed, including the first complete Slavonic Bible. Due to the great turmoil, though, St. Job withdrew to the ancient Pochaev monastery, where the miraculous icon of the Pochaev Mother of God was kept. The monks there felt the sanctity of St. Job, and thus elected him abbot. He set about immediately to organize the brethren, build a stone church (which still exists), and start the printing of Orthodox books. St. Job was able to enlist the help of wealthy Orthodox patrons, but he also angered the Catholic nobles by his zeal. One named Firlei was able
to confiscate the land and possessions of the Pochaev monastery (and even the icon!). St. Job had to turn to the Polish courts for their return. The venerable Job also participated at the council convened at Kiev in 1628, which was a great uplift for the Orthodox pastors of Polish occupied Ukraine.
St. Job was a true ascetic as well as an able administrator. He would often withdraw to a cave where he would spend nights in prayer. His vigils were so long that his feet would bleed, and divine light was seen to shine forth from the cave.
Seven days before he reposed, St. Job received a revelation as to exactly when he would die. On October 28,1651, after serving Divine Liturgy, St. Job reposed peacefully. His relics were discovered to be whole and incorrupt after seven years, and transferred to the church of the Holy Trinity on August 28,1659. Dozens of miracles issued forth from the relics, witnessed by not only Orthodox but also by Catholics as well, into whose hands the Pochaev monastery passed for 110 years. After the return of the monastery to the Orthodo church, miracles continued, as they do to this day, as a service and akathist were composed to the saint. The Church has designated two feasts to St. Job: August 28, the uncovering of his relics and October 28, his repose.

Here is his Icon

]http://www.stjohndc.org/Icons/214.htm]

[ 04-08-2002: Message edited by: OrthoMan ]

Dear Orthoman,

If you read Ukrainian, the Orthodox Metropolitan Ilarion Ohienko's book on the Pochayivska Lavra makes for a fascinating read on this subject.

He, like you, also says how ironic it is that Job's cause should have been promoted by those who would have, in life, considered him their enemy!

Job was clearly harassed by the Latins and opposed the Unia, to be sure.

But many Eastern Catholics, including Roman Catholics, didn't hold this against him. The Basilians, at this juncture (latter part of the 17th century certainly didn't believe themselves to be "Orthodox" but full-fledged Catholics . . .

They were the ones who brought in statues etc. into Pochayiv - no Orthodox consciousness there!

Job was a national saint in the eyes of the people, Eastern Catholic or Orthodox. Roman Catholics approached his relics and received miraculous cures, as is illustrated in one of the icons of the miracles of Pochayiv at the back of the Cathedral on the walls.

Pochayiv is still listed as a Roman Catholic shrine of the Mother of God in Poland as well!

I have a description of the Catholic papal coronation of this icon by an Orthodox writer in Ukraine and it is quite amazing. People lined up for confession for three days before, cannon were shot, people feasted etc.

Also, while Job was certainly Orthodox, he actually wasn't known for what I will call "nasty anti-Unia outbursts."

He repeated the Jesus Prayer constantly, and his publishing centre at Pochayiv was more concerned with the publication of Orthodox liturgical and catechetical works to keep the people grounded in Orthodoxy. There was actually very little of the polemical in them, although there was that too.

Again, this was not enough to "turn people off" him, whether Eastern or Roman Catholic.

To this day, the Basilian publication "Two Molebens" and others bear a picture of St Job praying with prayer rope in hand before the Pochayiv Mother of God. There is never an inscription beneath the picture to identify him, however.

Something similar happens with St Vladimir where, in his Orthodox Akathist, it is stated that he preferred "true Orthodoxy" over the "Catholic heresy" or words to that effect.

In the Russian Byzantine Catholic version, this is simply changed to "the beautiful services of the Christian East."

Personally, given the number of miracles St Job has granted to so many Orthodox, Eastern Catholic and Roman Catholic venerators, I guess he just isn't one to discriminate!

But if you read Ukrainian, Metropolitan Ohienko's book is terrific!

Alex

What was "false" about it?

The fact that it happened peacemeal (eparchy by eparchy), or that it was declared by the Orthodox Rus' bishops without the consent of the people?

Or perhaps that it was not a true union, in that the (former) Orthodox did not truly accept (Roman) Catholicism but only the appearance of it? But if Uniates are Roman Catholics as you say, doesn't that mean that they have fully accepted every tenet and precept of Roman Catholicism? So where's the falsehood in that?

I guess that means that in addition to being Roman Catholic heretics, Uniates are even worse in that they are also actively involved in deception.

Perhaps the author is asserting that "false union" was imposed by force, and when the force was lifted the Unia ceased to be?

[ 04-08-2002: Message edited by: RichC ]