VIVA LA PAPA


A Papal Succession Primer
An aging and ailing pope is inevitably cause for speculation as to who his successor will be -- and how he will be chosen. The ritual papal election has always attracted special attention, as detailed sacred procedures are followed to secure a legitimate succession of power. Here's a brief outline of how it's done:
READ MORE
http://www.time.com/time/daily/special/papacy/how.html

Randy

Thank you for that - but I think it should not be considered until after the Repose of our beloved Holy Father.

Any speculation as to what will happen in the Conclave is wrong.

Let us continue to keep the Holy Father in our prayers - and just ask that His will is done.

Lord have mercy

Anhelyna

Of Course, but I think that soon our Lord will be calling our beloved Holy Father. We just need to educate ourself now ...what to expect next.

I don't know your age, but I remember exactly the process during the papal elections beginning with John XXIII. I know what to expect next, I am just not looking forward to it. Prayers for our Holy Father.

I agree with Anhelyna. While I, too remember "what comes next", I think that we should confine ourselves to prayers for the Pope, and remember that from the time of his death until his successor is elected, we will be subjected to a media barrage that we will all tire of exceedingly swiftly. We can "educate ourselves then". Now, it is time to pray.

Gaudior, agreeing with Charles on not looking forward to it.

Sure .. prayer is important too.....

Those of us who are older have seen this process several times...(I have seen it four times myself)...so as ByzanTN so rightly says, we know how the process works. I think it is important NOT to rush into the future, but always to live in the present moment...just as the Gospels and all of Divine Revelation is written in the present moment. God is found in the 'HERE AND NOW' and not in the future...and we need to live in that way always. As much as it is a temptation to rush into the future---there is only ONE WAY to get there...and that's by living in 'THE NOW'! Let us pray for the Holy Father, Pope John Paul II and assist him by accompanying him with our poor prayers...until the Lord calls him forth into Eternal Life.

Most Holy Mother of God, 'Gate of Heaven,' stay near our Holy Father and steady his heart and his soul for whatever your Son, Our Lord Jesus Christ asks of him!

In the Risen Saviour,
+Fr. Gregory

I agree... Father Gregory. JP II is the only pope in my life time. Yes prayer is necessary here..

Here is the latest UPDATE ONLINE

POPE: 117 CARDINALS ON STANDBY FOR CONCLAVE (AGI) - Vatican City, Apr 1 - It has been over a month that the mass media report the Vatican opinions of the influential ecclesiastical exponents to succeed Pope John Paul II. There are now 117 cardinals who would participate to a possible conclave: it was in the last couple of days that Angolan Alexandre do Nascimento and Ecuadorean Antonio Jose' Gonzalez Zumarraga turned 80. The next cardinal to come out of the electors will be the Emeritus Patriarch of Venice, Marco Ce', who will turn 80 on July 8. The Italian contingent until then will be composed of twenty cardinals and even after Ce's leaving will still be the largest: in the cardinal college; all five continents are present numbering 66 countries, 52 of which have cardinal electors and among these besides Italy only the USA, with 11 members, exceed the threshold of ten representatives in the conclave. It is not by chance that the group of Italian cardinals is largest and this massive presence will not be non-influential in a possible conclave. Among the twenty Italian cardinals the most popular name is Milan Archbishop Dionigi Tettamanzi's.


SOURCE:

http://www.agi.it/english/news.pl?doc=20...e-eng.oggitalia

Randy, CHRIST IS RISEN! But not just prayer only---we are called to actually LIVE in the HERE AND NOW...in the present moment, because that is where we will meet Christ! If we do not meet Him in the present moment, we will not meet Him at all!

He IS Risen and in our very midst!

In that presence,
+Fr. Gregory

That is not an update about the pope, Randy, but a news bulletin about the College of Cardinals.

Gaudior, who is beginning to think there are things even youth does not excuse.

Dear Father Gregory,

I like what you wrote about "Here and Now". Our prayers should be with the Holy Father, "here and now".

A while back I remember a thread here where someone wrote that not only do they pray for the present Pope but they also pray for the next Pope, without speculating on who it will be or when it will be or how it will come about. I also liked that and found it to be wise and prudent.

In Christ, Bill

Okay, come on, everyone! We are all praying for the Holy Father but let's be fair to Randy! Yes, a lot of us here have lived through more than one papal election but a lot have not. I think Randy just wanted to share some information which he himself found interesting and informative - I didn't find it disrespectful at all.

And Randy, speaking as one who has also lived through several papal elections, and who remembers exactly where she was when the election of our Holy Father, John Paul the Great, was announced, I think what the others are saying is that this Pope has a history of confounding those who predict his death - they've been predicting it pretty much since he was elected! So don't take it personally if some folks seem irritated with you - they're just worried, that's all.

Yes our prayer is Here and Now. I also think that we need to pray for our One Holy Catholic Church to remain united .

Very Much Mahalo, Thiest.... thanks. JP 11 my first pope in my lifetime...

I keep thinking of a line from an old movie - it may help you to keep things in perspective today:

-- "Raiders of the Lost Ark":

Not to dampen our understandable enthusiasm and interest in the process of the next papal election, I would like to forewarn that the real "primer" on papal succession is the Apostolic Constitution "Universi Dominici Gregis" issued in 1996 by Pope John Paul II himself.

The 1996 AC abrogates, supercedes, or otherwise amends any and all existing Codes and/or canons governing the election of the next Pope. And during the vacancy of the Apostolic See due to the Pope's death, only the College of Cardinals, as a body, can interpret (not modify) its provisions.

TIME's "primer" is outdated and contains some incorrect information. For one, the Camerlengo IS NOT the head of the College of Cardinals. The head is the Dean, who is currently Cardinal Ratzinger, and, in his stead, the Subdean/Vice Dean.

Amado

Yes, Let us pray very hard for OUr Holy Father and all those who are approaching death. the devil is very busy as we approach the hour of death. It is the devil's last chance to capture the soul for himself.

Originally posted by Theist Gal:
"... a lot of us here have lived through more than one papal election but a lot have not. ..."

In 1978, I was a novice on Athos, and I did not even know that the Roman Pope was dead until I knew who the next pope was. When I heard about John Paul II, my reply is that I heard about the new pope a month or two ago, but the monk telling me explained that there was another new pope, because one died after a short reign. John Paul I caused much confusion seeking in Greek, since double names are not idiomatic, even for laymen, in Greek.

So, I have never followed a papal elected, although I lived through a few (Paul VI's election is confused in my memory with Kennedy's assassination, both having displaced Captain Kangaroo, and for John XXIII's election I was an infant).

I'm certain that the American media will devote excessive time to the matter, as they did to O.J.Simpsom's trial and to the Schiavo fiasco, and many things in between ... When the US obliterated Serbia, the Serbians called it "Monica's War" because it effectively displace the Lewinsky saga from the headlines.

It's fortunate for me that this is in the middle of Great Lent, because, even though I don't own a TV and generally eschew the American "news" media, I could get drawn into following this obsessively. I hope to hear little about it until the next Roman Pontiff has done something newsworthy.

Type to you later,
Photius, Reader

Greetings everyone and Aloha,


I found this website last nite....
it is more updated...

http://www.papalelections.com/ ( Papa Election : How it works )

I have no problem with Randy and suspect he's a pretty good guy. This is new to him, and I understand the feelings of aprehension, interest, concern, etc. and all that goes with those feelings. Although I have seen this 4 times before - I was pretty young when John XXIII was elected, but do remember it - it is a process that still puts me a bit on edge. I am sure we will all rejoice for the new pope, but none of us looks forward to giving up the current pope.

I just had a question. I was watching film of the cardinals as they proceeded into the Vatican to elect John Paul II. I notice that Byzantine Rite cardinals were included in the Group. I know that it is possible for Catholic male to be elected as the Pope, but could we have an Eastern Rite Pope?

As an Orthodox Christian, I believe we join in your prayers just as we would join in the pray for any other great Christian leader. We also hope that the new Pope, whoever he may be and whenever he takes the office, is another great leader for your church.

Technically it's possible - the new Pope has to be male and catholic - does not say Latin Catholic - the question really is would any Eastern Cardinal or other candidate get enough votes ?

Dear Randy,

I think you mean "VIVA IL PAPA!" as in "Long live the Pope."

"The Pope" is masculine, so it is il not la.

Viva la papa is long live the potato in Spanish.

Tony

Dear jporthodox:

Currently, there are 5 Eastern Rite Cardinals in the Sacred College: the respective Patriarchs of the Copts, the Maronites, and the Syrians and the Major Archbishops of the UGCC and the Syro-Malabars.

The Patriarchs of the Armenians, Melkites, and Chaldeans have not been created Cardinals.

Both the Maronite (HB Cardinal Sfeir) and Coptic (HB Cardinal Ghattas) Patriarchs are over 80 and, therefore, cannot vote but can be voted upon. HB Daoud, Patriarch Emeritus of the Catholic Syrians, is a Cardinal Elector, as well as Cardinals Husar and Vithayatil, and all 3 will join the Conclave to elect the next Pope if and when Pope John Paul II reposes in the Lord.

Amado

Thanks for Correction Braddah Tony... very much mahalo and aloha.

Tony observed:



In my native dialect, which was influenced by almost 400 years of Spanish colonization, it means: "Long live the (wild) duck!"

Amado

From where I came from ....Papa means Father.

Well Randy, in Spanish El Papa is The Pope, la papa is the potatoe. In Italian it is Il Papa, I don't know what, if anything, la papa would mean in Italian. And, el papá is the father, while el papa is the pope. Obviously these last two words are related.

Best wishes.

T

Amado,

That's interesting. I guess that comes from pato/pata, the modern standard Spanish for duck? Pata -> papa...? Hmmm. Is that standard Tagalog?

I remember overhearing some Filipinos speaking Spanish among themeselves some years back and it was really pretty interesting. Not quite like any accent I had heard before but clearly proper Spanish.

Best wishes,

Tony

GOT IT! Can we go back to the original topic of this tread?

More about the Conclave and the process....

here is my message board... I have more info down there...

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/innercitymonk/

Tony,

did you attend spelling class with former VP Dan Quayle? :p

Tony,

did you attend spelling class with former VP Dan Quayle? :p

In all candor, the definitive primer on papal succession /election is the Apostolic Constitution, Universi Dominici Gregis

Hear O Lord, our prayers for the Servant of the servants of God, the Holy Father, John Paul, Pope of Rome, and at the moment of his falling asleep in You, grant him a safe and peaceful journey and place him with your Saints in the glorious light of Your Presence, where there is no pain, sorrow, nor mourning! O Gracious Lord hear us and have mercy!

Dear Tony:

No, it is Ilocano, the language of Northern Philippines, 2nd or 3rd largest of the 7 major Filipino languages. Pilipino is the "national" language, based on Tagalog.

All of the major languages were later influenced by Spanish. But those Filipinos you heard speaking in "Spanish" might have been Chavacanos, a minority (from Cavite and Zamboanga) who sprinkle their "Spanish" with some Pilipino words!

The Philippines, as a country, spoke Spanish up to the 1920s or even later. But with the American colonization in place since 1898, English became more and more the 2nd language of the majority.

By the 1960s, our Congress passed a law removing Spanish as a required language to learn. We lost our hispanic indentity by then and became those "little brown Americans!" Fortunately, we remained Catholic to this day (3rd largest in the world next to Brazil and Mexico), courtesy of madre Espana.

Today, you hear Filipinos speaking in "Taglish," a crazy combination of Pilipino, Spanish, and English, reflecting our 3 official languages.

However "Papa," with the accent on "a" as you correctly put, is also the term of endearment for a "father" for ALL Filipinos, Ilocanos included!

I really don't know how and why Ilocanos came to call wild ducks "papa" (without the accent) because we, likewise, call domesticated ducks, male or female, "pato!" "Pata" to us is not a female duck but refers to pork hock!

Amado

Dan Quayle..... I wonder what happen to him now.... anyone have an update?

Reverend,

Looks like it, huh? I never really got those silent vowels in English. Sorry if it offends, my English spelling used to be good...used to be. Not any more

Tony,

just a gentle ribbing...

have a blessed Fast!

Amado,

Of course, pata is also paw in Spanish

Amadeus, forgive me if this was posted someplace else (I couldn't find it). Is there a listing somewhere on the web of the names and rite/church of the eastern cardinals?