Sorry for my memory problem here, but I cannot recall which monastery puts out icons which are extremely 'questionable' in nature which you all have discussed. Someone said not to buy them ...
I want to know the name of it, so that I will not buy nor recommend any of these by mistake ... what's the name of this place?
thanks ...
c of s

I think the monastery is called the Light of Christ Monastery in Borrego Springs, CA. Icons from there are referred to as Monastery Icons.

Here's a link so you can take a look for yourself and make your own judgements.

www.monasteryicons.com/

God bless,
John

Dear Friends,

I guess I'll have to tell the pastors who stock their items what a terrible mistake they are making . . .

That is no small feat since one or two of these believe they NEVER make mistakes

Their icons of western saints are very good and since I don't know of anywhere else to get some of them, why not? Just get a priest to bless them, something that should be done with any icon, if someone entertains any doubts.

What is the difference for an Eastern Catholic between buying an icon from this place or buying one from an Orthodox group, like Holy Transfiguration, that doesn't always have kind things to say about us "uniates?"

Also, their prayer beads are quite beautiful and very "handy" to use.

Oops, I guess I've brought on an excommunication on myself . . .inadvertently of course.

Just give me sixty days to think it over before repenting.

Alex

Alex,

Te ego absolvo +



Don

Although, as Alex says, these icons may not be to everyone's taste, I like them. When I had my chapel and was cramped for space, I used several of them in my chapel and everyone commented on how beautiful they were. I also have given them frequently as gifts and there were treasured by the ones who received them. As for the place in which they are made...leave that to God, have them blessed and venerate them with a clear conscience. It is the person depicted that is venerated, not the hands that made the image after all. Keep some perspective folks. Don

I, too, have several icons from Monastery Icons in my home. I love the deep, brilliant colors.

Khrystyna

Hello:

I am completely lost.

What is wrong with these icons? They are SUPERB!

Shalom,
Memo.

Dear Friends,

After hearing about what some Orthodox had to say about these icons and the monastery in which they are produced (they are the same Orthodox who hold all "uniates" in the lowest of regard as well), I called the monastery up and asked them about a few issues.

We should follow Don's advice and just have them blessed.

I know a number of Roman Catholics who like the iconic versions of western devotional themes in some of their icons and use them.

My rule of thumb is if an icon (or statue) is inspiring, what is wrong?

This monastery has adopted culturally to certain Hindu traditions of India, but so have Catholics living in India and Assyrians too.

Their prayer beads are done in the Hindu/Buddhist tradition, but such beads are used by Christian monks and nuns in India as well.

And they are beautiful and inscribed with a Cross.

Alex

Bless me a sinner, Father Don!

Thanks for the absolution!

Alex

Alex,

I already hear the sounds of hordes of Roman Catholics petitioning for your instant canonization! Thank you!

Khrystyna

There is wisdom in Alex’s statement. The difference here is that icons that are not written as prayer are not icons and show it. I remember years ago the pastor of a local Byzantine Catholic parish sent an icon print of the Nativity of Christ to Korea to be painted as a five foot tall, three panel icon to be displayed in his church. The copy was perfect to the tinest detail but it lacked the grace and life that exists in a real icon. It was a painting, nothing more. There are those prayerful people who can, with just one glance, immediately tell if an icon or statue is a vessel of prayer. I suspect that Alex is one of these people. He can tell just by looking at it.

Admin

Dear Administrator,

Well, I don't know if I can . . .

There are icons that are a definite turn-off, even when they are not written by "Gnostic Orthodox" .

Personally, I find the Greek style of Icon-writing to be too stern for my passionate Slavic blood (with a good dose of Romanian thrown in).

The Slavic icon style with its "heart-rending" inspiration leads us to prayer with tears as our heart is touched.

The Jesus Prayer spirituality is very much like that too.

There is a Grotto of "Our Lady of Huronia" at the Martyrs' Shrine at Midland, Ontario.

It is a simple white statue, but when you approach it, you want to fall on your knees in prayer before it.

Whatever works!

Alex

Dear Krystyna,

As long as they do an icon, rather than a statue . . .

May God forgive me a sinner for all the sins of my life, in what I have done and what I have failed to do, and grant me sufficient time for repentance!

You reduce me to tears!

That's good . . .

Alex

I wholeheartedly agree with Don, especially as we have been the recipient of several of his nice icons

I have seen some icons from some "canonical" sources that are not as efficacious as some of those from this monastery (I always get comments about the Mary Magdelene icon, Don )

Perhaps I shouldn't apologize for my poor memory regarding this, for I find all of your comments most enlightening!
I just couldn't recall what I had read, previously, only that it wasn't favorable. I thought it was on this web site, but I wonder if it were another? It was some months ago. (I used to look at a couple of other sites but now I stick to this one! )
Anyway, I haven't looked at the link yet as I just got in from work but will do so later.
Thanks again and if you all have more to say, just keep on going ...!

Yours
in the Communion of Saints ...

I dont have enough money to buy any better.

I thought that another suspect group was in Nebraska.

A priest from the Antiochian Orthodox Archdiocese wrote quite a scathing analysis of their failings (as a holy community of iconographers).

In Christ.

Hello:

With all due respect, I'd have to say that this extrapolation of artistic perception into spiritual judgement is dangerous, to say the least.

If a particular piece of religious art doesn't inspire us, it doesn't mean that it cannot inspire anybody, much less that the author was not truly expressing his/her "o"rthodox faith by creating it.

Religious art, as long as it reflects correct doctrine and respect for the represented person or object, is to be appreciated.

Our personal taste, we must keep it personal, both in our hearts and when we express it to others.

Shalom,
Memo.

Dear Memo,

But that doesn't mean that the Administrator can't tell a spiritually gifted person when he sees one . . .

Alex

Dear Memo,

When did we begin to consider true icons as art?

In my book, art stops at the end of creation. The properly written icon is a window into eternity. For this reason, icons written without proper spiritual/prayer life behind them don't look onto eternity and are rightly considered just art and only as great as art can be, which is not much in comparison with eternity.

In Christ.

Dear Andrew,

Again, please refer to my response to Amado above . . .

Alex

Dear Alex,

Sorry, I couldn't find that response. Is that to Memo? On which day/time.

In Christ.

Dear Andrew,

The group that runs "Monastery Icons" was originally in Geneva, Neb. They then relocated to their current home in Borrego Springs, Calif.

Like many here I too own several of their icons and thought nothing wrong with them. However (and I am almost sure we discussed this at length in a thread on the pre-crash board) knowing what I know today, I would refrain from purchasing anything from them in the future. Why? Well, because they are non-canonical & unrecognized by any official church - East or West, Catholic or Orthodox, and some of their beliefs border on the syncretistic. This last fact was related to me from one of our priests who had dealings with them in the past. I wouldn't want to inadvertently support something that may be heterodox.

Again, this is my view of situation. If you feel comfortable buying their products - that fine with me.



PAX

Br. Elias

Dear Brother Elias,

Many RC schools and priests buy their iconic depictions of Western themes, including their Stations of the Cross.

Syncretistic? Sounds a bit like my old RC high school . . .

Alex

Dear Br. Elias,

I share your view and certainly wouldn't purchase or use them. I'm currently working to have some of them removed from the churches.

In Christ.

Dear Andrew,

Sometimes you can be a real spoil-sport . . .

Don't you have better things to occupy yourself with?

Like coming up with a more original screen-name here?

Alex

I agree, Alex. Orthodox should be more creative then that!

Hello:

Please define "properly written icon" without using any terms that would imply you're talking about a piece of religious art.

Also, since we human beings are created in the image and likeness of God, then all that we are, and all that we do has the potential to be a window into eternity.

The Gospel is full of such windows: A coin found, a tree grown, a sheep cared for, a seed sown.

Thank you.

Shalom,
Memo.

Dear Alex,

I didn't say what I would do with them should I have them removed. Hint: it's a fate much worse than the basement!

In Christ.

Dear Memo,

Thanks for your well-defined question.

We have a priest here in Philadelphia who works among the homeless children of the streets and he has often taught us in the same vein as you write. He says that we and all things are icons. Some are holy icons and some are unholy icons. Even we who aspire to or believe that we are creeping closer to God, are still damaged icons. We all fall short of the glory of which we are the icon and likeness.

In this regard, the degree of holiness transcends issues of technical correctness (I'm not speaking of doctrinal correctness, for many an heresy was couched in beautiful words or writing; and Satan himself was the most brilliant of all the angels.) I'm speaking of the effort to suppress the influences of this world and look into the next. For this reason, the masters place such incredible weight upon the prayer life of the writer as a prerequisite to the work.

A true iconographer would just as soon give his work to a passing admirer or tourist (surmising that the Holy Spirit has blown this lost soul into his presence) than sell it for the due and deserved monetary rewards.

The holiness (meaning the "otherliness" or degree to which this person has "set this work aside" [from other tasks] to the glory of God) of the writer's effort is why God grants the writer's hands, the wood and the egg tempura (and maybe even acrylics?) the ability to show us a glimpse into the transfigured life of heaven.

So you are 100% correct! [except that I add one or two words]: "all that we are and all that we do [that is holy] has the potential to be a window into eternity."

When I argue or curse my brother, I have no ability to open a window onto heaven. In fact some would say that when one does this, one opens a window onto hell!

Lord have mercy.

In Christ.