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here is a good one to try & figure out #274142 01/20/08 05:28 PM
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Dandelion Offline OP
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Hi......

I haven't switched officially to the Byzantine rite so I am still under Roman/Latin rules so to speak. I am not able to make the Liturgy today because of my work schedule, so I decided to go to Mass to fulfill weekly obligation and wonder if I didn't attend Mass today can it be considered a mortal sin for not crazy fulfilling weekly obligation?

I am Thankful for being able to go to receive, but I can't help feeling as though I am in the Roman Army (sitting/standing/kneeling) there in the Roman church.


confused , crazy & blush

Dandelion

Re: here is a good one to try & figure out [Re: Dandelion] #274144 01/20/08 05:48 PM
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I am not sure of your question here. Catholics are obliged to assist at the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass on all Sundays of the year, as well as all Holy Days of Obligation, except for just reason. If you have a question about whether your reason is "excused," or not, I would think you might need to consult your confessor. (Nurses are given a dispensation from assisting at Sunday Mass -- if they are obliged to care for the sick, for example.)

Re: here is a good one to try & figure out [Re: AdsumJDS] #274175 01/20/08 10:46 PM
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Dandelion,

A Latin attending with the intention to canonically transfer enrollment to another Church sui iuris, but not yet transferred, is bound by the canonical requirements of the Latin Church as to fasting, observance of holydays, etc. As JDS has observed, the obligation is dispensed in instances of impossibility.

You should consult with a confessor as to whether the circumstances you describe satisfy the requirements for dispensation without the need to formally seek such. Ordinarily, a Latin continues to have a Sunday obligation until such time as he or she is no longer a Latin; the obligation thereafter is dependent on the Particular Law of the Church sui iuris in which he/she is then enrolled.

Many years,

Neil


"One day all our ethnic traits ... will have disappeared. Time itself is seeing to this. And so we can not think of our communities as ethnic parishes, ... unless we wish to assure the death of our community."
Re: here is a good one to try & figure out [Re: Irish Melkite] #274225 01/21/08 01:38 AM
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OK... how about this one. A Latin Catholic with Eastern leanings drives over one hour to go to Divine Liturgy. When he gets there he finds out that the priest who has to fly in from Chicago each weekend, never left Chicago because the city is snowed in.

Now, one of the parishioners decides to hold a Reader's Service. The Latin decides to stay because he wants to be a part of the Eastern Church someday, yet he still is bound by the Latin rules. Did the Latin commit a mortal sin by not attending the Novus Ordo Mass down the street because he stayed for the Reader's Service?

Re: here is a good one to try & figure out [Re: Dr. Eric] #274229 01/21/08 01:51 AM
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The obligation to assist at the Holy Mass would still stand, I would think, as it was not at all impossible, or even difficult, to do so...

Re: here is a good one to try & figure out [Re: Dr. Eric] #274299 01/21/08 08:57 AM
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Irish Melkite Offline
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Originally Posted by Dr. Eric
OK... how about this one. A Latin Catholic with Eastern leanings drives over one hour to go to Divine Liturgy. When he gets there he finds out that the priest who has to fly in from Chicago each weekend, never left Chicago because the city is snowed in.

Now, one of the parishioners decides to hold a Reader's Service. The Latin decides to stay because he wants to be a part of the Eastern Church someday, yet he still is bound by the Latin rules. Did the Latin commit a mortal sin by not attending the Novus Ordo Mass down the street because he stayed for the Reader's Service?


Dr Eric,

I think a strong case can be made that participation in the Reader's Service satisfied the obligation in this instance.

Consider this - A Latin arrives at his canonical parish, only to find that the pastor and sole presbyter had suffered a heart attack two hours before and no priest was available to substitute on short notice. The equivalent of a Reader's Service (what the Latins term the Liturgy of the Word, I believe) is conducted for the unforewarned congregation that has filled the church in expectation of attending Mass. Is he obliged to, instead of staying for it or in addition to doing so, travel 6 blocks to the other parish in town and attend the Mass which will begin there in an hour?

I don't believe he is, as attendance at the service in which he participated is considered a valid substitute for attendance at Mass and is deemed to satisfy the obligation. Much depends on how legalistically and narrowly one interprets Canons 1247 and 1248. Note that C1248§2 doesn't say "hop in your car and get thee to another church" but, instead, speaks of participating in a Liturgy of the Word "in the parish church or some other sacred place". In your example, that the person happens to have selected, on that day, to be in a parish church other than their own (particularly in an era when no one is canonically bound to geographic parishes, as they once were), does not change the circumstances - albeit it's not a Latin parish.

Quote
Canon 1247

On Sundays and other holydays of obligation, the faithful are obliged to assist at Mass. They are also to abstain from such work or business that would inhibit the worship to be given to God, the joy proper to the Lord's Day, or the due relaxation of mind and body.

Canon 1248

§1 The obligation of assisting at Mass is satisfied wherever Mass is celebrated in a catholic rite either on a holyday itself or on the evening of the previous day.

§2 If it is impossible to assist at a eucharistic celebration, either because no sacred minister is available or for some other grave reason, the faithful are strongly recommended to take part in a liturgy of the Word, if there be such in the parish church or some other sacred place, which is celebrated in accordance with the provisions laid down by the diocesan Bishop; or to spend an appropriate time in prayer, whether personally or as a family or, as occasion presents, in a group of families.


The difference, as I see it, from Dandelion's example, is that hers sought to apply the particularities of Eastern Code to one not governed by it.

In your example, would it be edifying to hie thee off to the neighboring parish? Sure. Requisite? I think not - but I'm no one's confessor (other than to my 7 year old, who is his own worst snitch biggrin )

Many years,

Neil


"One day all our ethnic traits ... will have disappeared. Time itself is seeing to this. And so we can not think of our communities as ethnic parishes, ... unless we wish to assure the death of our community."
Re: here is a good one to try & figure out [Re: Irish Melkite] #274308 01/21/08 11:32 AM
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Dandelion Offline OP
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Irish Melkite,

You are right! in unscrambling what I am trying to say.
Thank You:)
Funny isn't? that both are Catholic (East & West church) yet different codes one has to follow.

Dandelion

Re: here is a good one to try & figure out [Re: Dandelion] #274604 01/22/08 06:27 PM
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Hello,

If you are still canonically a member of the Latin Church, you must follow the Latin norm.

Of course, that is fulfilled by attending the celebration of the Eucharist when it is celebrated validly and licitly according to *ANY* Catholic rite.

That means you (equally) fulfill your obligation if you attend a Latin-rite Mass, a Byzantine Divine Liturgy, a Maronite Divine Liturgy or an Armenian Divine Liturgy, regardless of your enrollment in any particular Sui Iuris Church or any process you are going through to transfer from one to another.

Now, if it is not reasonably possible for you to attend, then you are dispensed from the obligation. Attending a non-Catholic Divine Liturgy, a Catholic non-Eucharistic service or any other Christian prayer service might be the next-best thing, but it does NOT fulfill your obligation.

Again, if you have a good reason why you are not able to attend to the celebration of the Eucharist, you are dispensed. As to what is a good reason, that is something you would have to figure out with your confessor or spiritual director. I'd say serious health conditions often qualify, caring for someone who needs you generally qualifies. I'd say that work, if the schedule is imposed on you (as opposed to freely chosen) would also qualify, but again, talk about it to your person.

Take care!

Shalom,
Memo



Re: here is a good one to try & figure out [Re: Dandelion] #274668 01/22/08 11:20 PM
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"(sitting/standing/kneeling)"

Yeah, that "Roman Army" stuff can get to be a real pain. confused... smirk ... biggrin

Dear Dandelion,
Good advice from all above.
Be true to your heart and your heart will be true to you.

God bless,
Bill

Re: here is a good one to try & figure out [Re: rcguest] #274696 01/23/08 01:18 AM
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Originally Posted by rcguest
"(sitting/standing/kneeling)"


AKA "Church with calisthenics" according to an Episcopalian friend.


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