The Byzantine Forum
Newest Members
BrotherIsaac, SeekingLight, NoTrueScotsman, Soraya, CuriousMarten
5,759 Registered Users
Who's Online Now
2 members (Fr. Al, 1 invisible), 98 guests, and 56 robots.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Latest Photos
Church of St Cyril of Turau & All Patron Saints of Belarus
Byzantine Nebraska
Byzantine Nebraska
by orthodoxsinner2, December 11
Church of the Holy Trinity (UGCC) - Brazil
Church of the Holy Trinity (UGCC) - Brazil
by Santiago Tarsicio, March 17
Papal Audience 10 November 2017
Papal Audience 10 November 2017
by JLF, November 10
Upgraded Russian icon corner
Upgraded Russian icon corner
by The young fogey, October 20
Forum Statistics
Forums26
Topics35,045
Posts413,994
Members5,759
Most Online3,380
Dec 29th, 2019
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Page 1 of 2 1 2
#285372 04/05/08 07:24 PM
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 298
Member
OP Offline
Member
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 298
A couple of days ago, I processed a French couple, who was coming to the U.S. for a religious retreat. I asked them if it was a Catholic retreat and they said no it was for Scientology. I work at Miami airport in Passport Control and occasionally get people like that couple, who come to Florida for Scientology retreats, or reincarnation seminars. I was a little troubled by their reply and said a prayer for them that night.
Does anyone have a clue why a couple from France, with a two-thousand year history of Catholicism, would be interested in a whack-job religion like Scientology?

Wolfgang #285385 04/06/08 12:40 AM
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 1,125
E
Za myr z'wysot ...
Member
Offline
Za myr z'wysot ...
Member
E
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 1,125
Scientology is a religion that appeals to the wealthy, simply because it doesn't challenge their consciences in any way and besides--anything that costs that much money must be worth it!

I happened to read an interview given by L. Ron Hubbard Jr. during the period in his life when he was still trying to expose his father as a fraud--about 25 years ago. He had grown up in Scientology, and simply assumed it was true. Then, when he learned better, he was horrified and felt an obligation to rectify this wrong. At some point after that, however, he must have realized there was a lot more money to be made by championing the multi-million dollar Scientology organization than by opposing it.

May God in His mercy yet show him the light!


Peace,
Deacon Richard

Wolfgang #285431 04/06/08 04:19 PM
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 476
Member
Offline
Member
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 476
If I'm not mistaken, Scientology is banned in some European countries (e.g. Germany, Spain, and Greece) that claim it is subversive to government interests.

However, make sure to not to confuse Scientology with Christian Science, which is a somewhat respectable Protestant sect founded in the 19th century that runs an amazing daily newspaper:

[b]The Christian Science Monitor[/b]

Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 155
Nan Offline
Member
Offline
Member
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 155
I believe Scientology is considered to be a cult which is why it's banned in those countries; it's also banned in France. Based on Tom Cruise's criticism of Brooke Shields use of Paxil to deal with post-partum depression, it seems that Scientologists believe they're experts in medicine as well.

I would hesitate to describe a group that withholds medical treatment from children as "somewhat respectable" no matter your opinion of their periodicals. While adults are free to make the decision for themselves not to seek medical care, they have an affirmative duty to do so for their children. Christian Scientists do not.

Last edited by Nan; 04/06/08 06:23 PM.
Nan #285449 04/06/08 07:26 PM
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 384
E
Member
Offline
Member
E
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 384
From what little I have heard of Scientology it seems to be
total lunacy, but that is no justification for any government
to ban its practice in their country. Unless a "religion" advocates some
practice (like human sacrifice) opposed
to natural law, no govenment has any business interfering with it.
Error may have no rights, but erroneous people do have rights
including the right to be wrong.







Edmac #285451 04/06/08 07:49 PM
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 155
Nan Offline
Member
Offline
Member
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 155
Edmac, separation of church and state is not a given throughout the world, nor, unfortunately are human rights. One of the reasons countries ban Scientology is the commercial transaction involved; one pays for instruction.

Nan #285479 04/07/08 12:53 AM
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 476
Member
Offline
Member
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 476
Quote
I would hesitate to describe a group that withholds medical treatment from children as "somewhat respectable" no matter your opinion of their periodicals. While adults are free to make the decision for themselves not to seek medical care, they have an affirmative duty to do so for their children. Christian Scientists do not.


As regards the Christian Scientists (not the Scientologists) I think that the incident that you are refering to actually happened in 1911 and was a case of diphtheria for which at the time there was no known treatment and for which we only developed a vaccine in the 1980s. The recent case in Oregon did not deal with Christian Scientists, but rather "Followers of Christ" and the case in Wisconsin with non-denominational Christians.

Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 155
Nan Offline
Member
Offline
Member
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 155
Please do not presume that I refer to a specific case. There have been many documented instances of Christian Scientists withholding medical treatment from their children, resulting in said children's deaths when medical treatment was available.

I am well aware that Christian Scientists are not the only ones who refuse medical treatment for their children.

Are you a Christian Scientist?

Nan #285567 04/07/08 04:25 PM
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 476
Member
Offline
Member
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 476
Quote
Please do not presume that I refer to a specific case. There have been many documented instances of Christian Scientists withholding medical treatment from their children, resulting in said children's deaths when medical treatment was available.

I am well aware that Christian Scientists are not the only ones who refuse medical treatment for their children.

Are you a Christian Scientist?


No (my religious affiliation is in my profile). Nor do I hold their views on modern medicine. But they are a group for which I have great respect. Can you cite some sources for your claims?

Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 10,043
Likes: 7
Global Moderator
Member
Online Content
Global Moderator
Member
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 10,043
Likes: 7
Nan is correct. While Christian Scientists as a whole have somewhat modified their antipathy toward medicine, hard-line traditionalists among them continue to be vehemently opposed and there have been instances of children dying or being seriously endangered by their beliefs.

As they are a significantly more up-scale (economically and educationally) religious body of faithful and the Christian Science Monitor is a highly-respected journal, the Church of Christ, Scientist gets considerably less bad press about the matter than do the JWs. (The CS' long-time aversion to vaccination has, of course, been somewhat bolstered by a growing negativity to same among some in the general populace in recent years.) Nevertheless, the matter is of concern.

For FAQs prepared for media inquiries, see here

See also this article from a 1995 issue of Atlantic Monthly. It was written by a former member of the Church and discusses in detail the "child" cases, as well as Christian Science "healing" generally.


Many years,

Neil


"One day all our ethnic traits ... will have disappeared. Time itself is seeing to this. And so we can not think of our communities as ethnic parishes, ... unless we wish to assure the death of our community."
Epiphanius #285812 04/09/08 09:46 AM
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 298
Member
OP Offline
Member
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 298
Is Tom Cruise still a Scientologist?
What did Christ say about those given much responsibility?

Quote
Scientology is a religion that appeals to the wealthy, simply because it doesn't challenge their consciences in any way and besides--anything that costs that much money must be worth it!


That explains a lot! You must have lived on Miami Beach at one time Epiphanius grin.

Wolfgang #285829 04/09/08 01:04 PM
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 2,214
Member
Offline
Member
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 2,214
I thought Tom Cruise was fairly high up in their hierarchy. He has purchased the influence, at least.

I knew some Scientologists once, their son was into wicca and would experiment with spells and curses. I stopped contacting them after I read the Ron Hubbard Mission Earth series. Fortunately I don't remember much, unfortunately what I remember is what sickened me at the time. I was in 9th-10th grade.

Scientology is easy on the conscience and heavy on the wallet. What I find odd is that an invented religion could have such draw in so short a time. The mover can not be the First Mover, perhaps their influence has a spiritual element. It would not surprise me at all if there were demonic influences at play.

Terry

Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 476
Member
Offline
Member
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 476
Quote
For FAQs prepared for media inquiries, see here

See also this article from a 1995 issue of Atlantic Monthly. It was written by a former member of the Church and discusses in detail the "child" cases, as well as Christian Science "healing" generally.


Thank you that was very informative. I suppose that the Christian Scientists I know are of the more liberal(?) sort. From what I have been told, though, most Christian Scientists, will take their children to the doctor if it is warranted, but leave it up to them when they turn 18. I suppose this is the more liberal attitude, however.

Wolfgang #285892 04/10/08 12:12 AM
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 1,125
E
Za myr z'wysot ...
Member
Offline
Za myr z'wysot ...
Member
E
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 1,125
Originally Posted by Wolfgang
Originally Posted by Epiphanius
Scientology is a religion that appeals to the wealthy, simply because it doesn't challenge their consciences in any way and besides--anything that costs that much money must be worth it!

That explains a lot! You must have lived on Miami Beach at one time, Epiphanius grin.

LOL!

No, but I watch TV, and it amazes me sometimes to see people who seem to have so much money they have to go looking for things to do with it!


Peace,
Deacon Richard

Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 4,518
Catholic Gyoza
Member
Offline
Catholic Gyoza
Member
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 4,518
Originally Posted by Terry Bohannon
I thought Tom Cruise was fairly high up in their hierarchy. He has purchased the influence, at least.

It would not surprise me at all if there were demonic influences at play.

Terry


L Ron Hubbard was a disciple of Alestar Crowley. shocked

According to L Ron Hubbard Jr. $cientology is nothing but Black Magic strung out over decades to extort money from the masses who take their "courses."

Page 1 of 2 1 2

Link Copied to Clipboard
The Byzantine Forum provides message boards for discussions focusing on Eastern Christianity (though discussions of other topics are welcome). The views expressed herein are those of the participants and may or may not reflect the teachings of the Byzantine Catholic or any other Church. The Byzantine Forum and the www.byzcath.org site exist to help build up the Church but are unofficial, have no connection with any Church entity, and should not be looked to as a source for official information for any Church. All posts become property of byzcath.org. Contents copyright - 1996-2020 (Forum 1998-2020). All rights reserved.
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.5