To be in communion with Rome, you must hold to the same faith as Rome, even if you express that in different words.

For example, does the Roman Patriarch have the charisma of infallibility? Does the Pope have universal jurisdiction over the entire Church? Does the Holy Spirit proceed from the Father alone, or from the Father and the Son? Was the Theotokos immaculately conceived?

All of these things are matters of dogma within the Catholic Church. Whatever rite you follow, you cannot disagree with those statements and yet remain in communion with Rome.

We, the Orthodox, do disagree with those issues.

Our theology is different.

Grace and peace,
Rd John

1) If you're in communion with Rome, you must acknowledge the universal jurisdiction of the Pope, and also not disagree with any dogmas of the Catholic Church. Thus, you do not believe everything that Eastern Orthodoxy teaches.
2) No, to be in communion with Rome, you must acknowledge his authority beyond what the Orthodox believe to be the limits recognized in the first millennium.

You cannot be Catholic and deny the filioque or the universal jurisdiction of the Pope. You cannot be Orthodox and accept either teaching.

The Scriptures speak of "one Lord, **one faith**, one baptism." If you are in communion with someone, you share one faith with them. You are in communion with Rome. You are not in communion with us.

This isn't to be harsh, but merely to acknowledge reality.

Eastern Catholics have the same or similar outward rites and services as the Orthodox, but they differ in matters of faith and internal theology.

Grace and peace,
Rd John

we share the same view of the theotokos as orthodox as I have already stated in this thread. The filioque is not added in the creed I recite, nor might I add in a few of the roman churches I have attended.I never said that I am in communion with orthodox. However I would like to add I do acnowledge one baptism and that means I acnowledge yours too.

in peace.

David

ThePilgrim has spoken volumes in a few short posts.

If I hear "Orthodox in communion with Rome" one more time, I think my head will explode! (Monomakh and Stephanie, get the duct tape ready!)

A Ford and a Chevy do the same thing, but nothing is exactly the same between the two, other than they are both cars. Nothing will interchange.

Until East and West roll off the same assembly line and agree on matters of faith, there will be a world of difference.

i never said that perhaps you can use the duct tape to stop yourself from jumping the gun

this thread has been taken totally out of context. I was only trying to help someone out by letting her know to the best of my ability the practice of the byzantine church.

C. I. X.

In John 17:11, if I may be evangelical did not Christ pray to His Father that we be one, as They are one? Was He praying for clones? Do not the four evangelists report the same thing but in different (and even conflicting) perspectives? If these are Holy Mysteries, who is so arrogant to understand them with human limitations? Can God make a void He cannot fill?

Are papal pronouncements not local unless he is proclaiming that agreed by a full assembly of an Ecumenical Council? When was the last ECUMENICAL Council? When did the papacy ADD dogma (not a Latin clarification) to the Creed? In what language is the Creed definitive, pig-Latin? When are the theological arguments the dogma?

The Holy Trinity is the dogma, how It works is the mystery. The pristine human mother is the dogma, how she got that way is the mystery. We must believe the reality but how can we understand the Mystery? We may have a human perspectives but who is so presumptuous to claim Divine Understanding?

Armchair theologians have waged enough crusades, inquisitions and wars. Stop the arrogance and let the major archbishops meet and ponder these various perspective to tell us what, not how. Or agree not to agree in our time, in our limitations of understanding. Christ taught us to feed the hungry, clothe the naked, bury the dead and visit the imprisoned not understand the Mystical. Or is this only a Christian teaching not a Catholic or (radical) orthodox one?

Greek is the definitive language of the Nicene-Constantinopolitan Creed.

Fr. Serge

Dewimelkite, the thread's not out of context because this is what a latin rite visitor needs to know about eastern catholic churches instead of joining an eastern catholic church and spending the next 20 years believing that this is just a primitive version of the latin church.

Pilgrim, I suggest you take the time to visit an eastern catholic seminary or talk to an eastern catholic priest. You'd be surprised to find that your assumptions are invalid. This is not to say that we are not catholic, but we are not roman catholic and don't necessarily hold to all the roman catholic dogma. Respect it as valid, yes, but practice and believe it no.

This post might prove helpful
http://www.byzcath.org/forums/ubbthreads.php/topics/63902/1/How_to_become_a_Byzantine_prie

Demimelkite, I didn't mean to come off as judging you; I simply meant to assure you that the thread hasn't gone off course.(Though that no one but me has replied makes me think it may be dead!)

thanks, I only meant that it was off topic in the sense that it became less about information and more about assumption.

From what I've read, it sure seems to me that Rome broke away from the original Catholic Church. Is what remained behind what is called 'Orthodox'? I was under the impression that the original Eastern church was still really 'Catholic'.

Thank you.

Catholic with a small c. I was taught in Catholic parochial school ( I'm a convert) that the Corporate title of the Church of Rome became the Roman Catholic Church at the time of the Council of Trent, although the nun who said this may have been wrong. BTW, Julia, I will not disagree with your comments. I would like to ask you a question. what is the implication you are making with your last positing on the issue?

C. I. X.
Just a local observation. Cradle Easterners chanting repetitive services here usually don’t use the books. One reason may be a personal absence of upper or lower cases in memorization. Are we what we pray while we study (question) what we read?

From what I've read, BOTH East and West share the blame in the Great Schism. Are you reading ONLY Eastern Orthodox books on the matter? Have you read any Catholic books on the matter? Perhaps you can read both to get a more balanced view of the matter. I hope this does not offend, but to blame the episode on one side is not a balanced view, IMHO.

Blessings,
Marduk