The Byzantine Forum
Newest Members
The Cub, P H, Hardrada, DMP, Kyrie Eleison
5601 Registered Users
Who's Online Now
0 registered members (), 50 guests, and 422 spiders.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Latest Photos
Church of the Holy Trinity (UGCC) - Brazil
Papal Audience 10 November 2017
Upgraded Russian icon corner
Russian Greek Catholic Global Congress
OL EuroEast II (2007) Group
Forum Statistics
Forums26
Topics34,725
Posts411,827
Members5,601
Most Online2,716
Jun 7th, 2012
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Page 1 of 2 1 2
Cardinal George in Chicago Suspends Priest #364048
05/05/11 02:53 AM
05/05/11 02:53 AM
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 388
Cleveland, Ohio
P
Polish American Offline OP
Member
Polish American  Offline OP
Member
P

Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 388
Cleveland, Ohio
Cardinal Francis George suspended an outspoken priest from St. Sabina Catholic Church, a South Side Chicago parish.

In a sternly written letter to Father Pfleger, the Cardinal referred to the priest's recent remarks in the media that he would leave the Catholic Church if he were removed from St. Sabina. "If that is your attitude, you have already left the Catholic Church and are therefore not able to pastor a Catholic parish," the Cardinal wrote.

http://www.courageouspriest.com/cardinal-george-suspends-priest

Last edited by Polish American; 05/05/11 02:57 AM.
Re: Cardinal George in Chicago Suspends Priest [Re: Polish American] #364437
05/14/11 04:56 PM
05/14/11 04:56 PM
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 543
tornado alley
monksilouan Offline
Member
monksilouan  Offline
Member

Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 543
tornado alley
Good for His Eminence! Enough of Father Pfleger's antics. Maybe he will find an assignment with Jeremiah Wright's "church" or in the Obama Administration.

Re: Cardinal George in Chicago Suspends Priest [Re: monksilouan] #364464
05/15/11 09:27 PM
05/15/11 09:27 PM
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 610
Ontario, Canada
J
JDC Offline
Member
JDC  Offline
Member
J

Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 610
Ontario, Canada
Originally Posted by monksilouan
Good for His Eminence! Enough of Father Pfleger's antics. Maybe he will find an assignment with Jeremiah Wright's "church" or in the Obama Administration.


Byzcath needs a "like" button.

Re: Cardinal George in Chicago Suspends Priest [Re: JDC] #364471
05/15/11 11:34 PM
05/15/11 11:34 PM
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 709
DC area
Penthaetria Offline
Member
Penthaetria  Offline
Member

Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 709
DC area
Originally Posted by JDC
Originally Posted by monksilouan
Good for His Eminence! Enough of Father Pfleger's antics. Maybe he will find an assignment with Jeremiah Wright's "church" or in the Obama Administration.


Byzcath needs a "like" button.

You may have been looking for a "Like" button, but I was looking for an "Offended" button.

If monksilouan believes that Fr. Pfleger is unworthy to serve the people of God in the Catholic Church, why would he wish to send an unworthy man to possibly damage the people of God in any setting? If monksilouan believes that Fr. Pfleger is too liberal, why would he wish that Fr. Pfleger find a position in the government that gives him power to further his political agenda?

We can be glad when a man who is not suited for the priesthood is removed from that office. To hope that he goes to an organization of which we disapprove is a most unbecoming attitude. We should not be sending "rejects" to those with whom we disagree; rather, we should be hoping that worthy men might enter their ranks and bring them closer to what we perceive to be the truth.

Last edited by Penthaetria; 05/15/11 11:34 PM.
Re: Cardinal George in Chicago Suspends Priest [Re: Polish American] #364475
05/16/11 01:33 AM
05/16/11 01:33 AM
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 9,962
Massachusetts
I
Irish Melkite Offline
Global Moderator
Irish Melkite  Offline
Global Moderator
Member
I

Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 9,962
Massachusetts
First off, I want to agree with the comments of my sister and friend, Alicia. If one considers an individual to be 'dangerous' in a position or unsuited for a role, one is not well advised to hope, wish, or pray that the person take up a similar capacity elsewhere.

Secondly, I think that the content and tone of the Cardinal's letter can't be faulted and, in fact, was remarkably diplomatic and well-phrased. However, I'm not convinced that the timing of the letter's release - to media prior to the addresse - was well-advised. That Father Pfleger had spoken out in public venues previous to the letter doesn't change that - this is not 'tit for tat' - it's a superior/subordinate relationship and the burden to take the higher road lies always with the superior.

Thirdly, it is notable that the Cardinal, in his correspondence, appears to be still trying to salvage the situation. Notably, responses here seem to reveling in the suspension as being a 'done deal' - 'he's gone' - 'good riddance'. That difference suggests a greater wisdom on the Cardinal's part than on those predicting the outcome as a foregone conclusion.

Having said all that, ...

The issues between the Cardinal and Father Pfleger are, in no small part, the creation of the Archdiocese of Chicago. In a canonical environment that generally provides for a maximum of two pastoral terms, totaling 10-12 years, Father Pfleger has pastored St Sabina's for 30 years. While many of us can speak of instances involving priests who served for decades in a single place and the incredible bonds that build between pastor and faithful in such cases, it also establishes a foundation for personality-based issues either when such a priest is transferred or for the successor priest when illness or death intervenes and forces change.

That said, Father Pfleger has certainly contributed to the situation himself by his outspokenness, the controversial stands and statements that he has made, and the fact that he can be easily perceived to be as much or more a social activist than a priest. While I certainly can't find myself in agreement with all of what he has undertaken to do historically, I find myself unwilling to accept blanket derision of his 'antics'.

Anyone with issues about this priest's activities, statements, and undertakings ought to be prepared to address them. On the other hand, they should be just as prepared to acknowledge the incredible good that he has accomplished in the past 30 years of ministry - both on a spiritual level and on a social level. He pastors a church that has made Catholicism spiritually relevant to a community that hasn't always seen it to be so. He has done so, in very large measure, by demonstrating that the Church's concern for its people does not end when the offertory collection has been taken and 'Ite Missa Est' intoned.

That concern, as he has demonstrated it to his congregation, means trying to end, or at least significantly reduce, violence and poverty in a community historically plagued by both. It means taking on special interests that target a community by advertising products that increase health risks to its members. All of that and more.

Michael Pfleger may not be the most obedient priest in the Chicago Archdiocese; he may not be the most politically correct one; he may even have a greater aptitude for social activism than he does for the priesthood - I don't know.

And, he may never be first in line to inherit the earth but, he has done a remarkable job of demonstrating the relevance of and the application of the works of mercy, both spiritual and corporal, to an urban world where they are sorely lacking.

Prayers for the quick resolution of the issues between Cardinal George and Father Pfleger in a way that will best serve the Church and its people, the parishioners of St Sabina's, the Archdiocese of Chicago, and two ordained men who both love their God and want to serve Him as best they can.

Many years,

Neil


"One day all our ethnic traits ... will have disappeared. Time itself is seeing to this. And so we can not think of our communities as ethnic parishes, ... unless we wish to assure the death of our community."
Re: Cardinal George in Chicago Suspends Priest [Re: Polish American] #364477
05/16/11 04:04 AM
05/16/11 04:04 AM
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 610
Ontario, Canada
J
JDC Offline
Member
JDC  Offline
Member
J

Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 610
Ontario, Canada
I rather took it as a joke and an observation more than a wish or a hope.

Re: Cardinal George in Chicago Suspends Priest [Re: Irish Melkite] #364482
05/16/11 02:07 PM
05/16/11 02:07 PM
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 1,953
Upstate New York
D
DMD Offline
Member
DMD  Offline
Member
D

Joined: May 2009
Posts: 1,953
Upstate New York
Originally Posted by Irish Melkite
First off, I want to agree with the comments of my sister and friend, Alicia. If one considers an individual to be 'dangerous' in a position or unsuited for a role, one is not well advised to hope, wish, or pray that the person take up a similar capacity elsewhere.

Secondly, I think that the content and tone of the Cardinal's letter can't be faulted and, in fact, was remarkably diplomatic and well-phrased. However, I'm not convinced that the timing of the letter's release - to media prior to the addresse - was well-advised. That Father Pfleger had spoken out in public venues previous to the letter doesn't change that - this is not 'tit for tat' - it's a superior/subordinate relationship and the burden to take the higher road lies always with the superior.

Thirdly, it is notable that the Cardinal, in his correspondence, appears to be still trying to salvage the situation. Notably, responses here seem to reveling in the suspension as being a 'done deal' - 'he's gone' - 'good riddance'. That difference suggests a greater wisdom on the Cardinal's part than on those predicting the outcome as a foregone conclusion.

Having said all that, ...

The issues between the Cardinal and Father Pfleger are, in no small part, the creation of the Archdiocese of Chicago. In a canonical environment that generally provides for a maximum of two pastoral terms, totaling 10-12 years, Father Pfleger has pastored St Sabina's for 30 years. While many of us can speak of instances involving priests who served for decades in a single place and the incredible bonds that build between pastor and faithful in such cases, it also establishes a foundation for personality-based issues either when such a priest is transferred or for the successor priest when illness or death intervenes and forces change.

That said, Father Pfleger has certainly contributed to the situation himself by his outspokenness, the controversial stands and statements that he has made, and the fact that he can be easily perceived to be as much or more a social activist than a priest. While I certainly can't find myself in agreement with all of what he has undertaken to do historically, I find myself unwilling to accept blanket derision of his 'antics'.

Anyone with issues about this priest's activities, statements, and undertakings ought to be prepared to address them. On the other hand, they should be just as prepared to acknowledge the incredible good that he has accomplished in the past 30 years of ministry - both on a spiritual level and on a social level. He pastors a church that has made Catholicism spiritually relevant to a community that hasn't always seen it to be so. He has done so, in very large measure, by demonstrating that the Church's concern for its people does not end when the offertory collection has been taken and 'Ite Missa Est' intoned.

That concern, as he has demonstrated it to his congregation, means trying to end, or at least significantly reduce, violence and poverty in a community historically plagued by both. It means taking on special interests that target a community by advertising products that increase health risks to its members. All of that and more.

Michael Pfleger may not be the most obedient priest in the Chicago Archdiocese; he may not be the most politically correct one; he may even have a greater aptitude for social activism than he does for the priesthood - I don't know.

And, he may never be first in line to inherit the earth but, he has done a remarkable job of demonstrating the relevance of and the application of the works of mercy, both spiritual and corporal, to an urban world where they are sorely lacking.

Prayers for the quick resolution of the issues between Cardinal George and Father Pfleger in a way that will best serve the Church and its people, the parishioners of St Sabina's, the Archdiocese of Chicago, and two ordained men who both love their God and want to serve Him as best they can.

Many years,

Neil


Amen, the issue with the Father, as I understand it, was not his social activism, but rather his lack of obedience to his Bishop.

This is a problem that exists in both Orthodoxy and Catholicism as one can see by the efforts of some to 'pin the blame' on Metropolitan Jonah's recent troubles on his signing of the 'Manhattan Declaration.'

Frankly, I resent constant efforts by some, Orthodox or Catholic alike, to portray one political ideology as being wholly within the province and teachings of the Church while the 'other' is perceived as intrinsically 'evil.' This goes for both lock-step, unthinking 'conservatives' and 'progressives'.

I for one will go along with the wise teachings of another Chicago cleric, the late Cardinal Bernadin ,when it comes to these matters.

Re: Cardinal George in Chicago Suspends Priest [Re: Penthaetria] #364485
05/16/11 04:11 PM
05/16/11 04:11 PM
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 543
tornado alley
monksilouan Offline
Member
monksilouan  Offline
Member

Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 543
tornado alley
Please forgive my poor attempt at humor. I truly pray for Father and I ask forgivness for anyone on the Forum that has been offended in any way. I certainly meant no harm. We all need to have our sins forgiven and I am foremost in this! I do not just say that to sound pious. It is true. There are many times when I say really stupid things but I can say that that is merely the result of being a dumb, old crippled monk. No malice was or is ever intended. Please forgive me!
Silouan, a dumb, sinful old man

Re: Cardinal George in Chicago Suspends Priest [Re: Polish American] #364567
05/22/11 04:21 AM
05/22/11 04:21 AM
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 9,962
Massachusetts
I
Irish Melkite Offline
Global Moderator
Irish Melkite  Offline
Global Moderator
Member
I

Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 9,962
Massachusetts
In what is, hopefully, a blessed end to the controversy, Cardinal George has reinstated Father Pfleger after the two met and resolved the issues that had arisen.

Reinstated Rev. Pfleger to return to pulpit, focus on healing the hurt

Many years,

Neil


"One day all our ethnic traits ... will have disappeared. Time itself is seeing to this. And so we can not think of our communities as ethnic parishes, ... unless we wish to assure the death of our community."
Re: Cardinal George in Chicago Suspends Priest [Re: Polish American] #364570
05/22/11 03:26 PM
05/22/11 03:26 PM
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 7,309
Falls Church, VA
S
StuartK Offline
Member
StuartK  Offline
Member
S

Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 7,309
Falls Church, VA
This is probably a mistake, but Cardinal George is certainly going the extra mile.

Re: Cardinal George in Chicago Suspends Priest [Re: JDC] #364571
05/22/11 03:42 PM
05/22/11 03:42 PM
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 10,930
Irondale,AL
Pani Rose Offline
Member
Pani Rose  Offline
Member

Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 10,930
Irondale,AL
Originally Posted by JDC
Originally Posted by monksilouan
Good for His Eminence! Enough of Father Pfleger's antics. Maybe he will find an assignment with Jeremiah Wright's "church" or in the Obama Administration.


Byzcath needs a "like" button.


Or clappy hands and dancing.

Stand up, stand up for Jesus, ye soldiers of the cross. Lift His royal banner, will not suffer loss.

When they stand for the truth, they will only gain priests, not loose them

Re: Cardinal George in Chicago Suspends Priest [Re: Irish Melkite] #364572
05/22/11 03:43 PM
05/22/11 03:43 PM
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 10,930
Irondale,AL
Pani Rose Offline
Member
Pani Rose  Offline
Member

Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 10,930
Irondale,AL
Originally Posted by Irish Melkite
In what is, hopefully, a blessed end to the controversy, Cardinal George has reinstated Father Pfleger after the two met and resolved the issues that had arisen.

Reinstated Rev. Pfleger to return to pulpit, focus on healing the hurt


Praise God!

I saw this after my other post. Healing is a wonderful thing.

Re: Cardinal George in Chicago Suspends Priest [Re: Polish American] #364615
05/23/11 10:02 PM
05/23/11 10:02 PM
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 388
Cleveland, Ohio
P
Polish American Offline OP
Member
Polish American  Offline OP
Member
P

Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 388
Cleveland, Ohio
Fr. Michael Pfleger is back in action after serving a three-week suspension imposed by Cardinal Francis George.

http://ncronline.org/news/people/pfleger-back-st-sabina-transition-plan-agreed-upon

Re: Cardinal George in Chicago Suspends Priest [Re: Polish American] #364656
05/25/11 12:26 AM
05/25/11 12:26 AM
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 543
tornado alley
monksilouan Offline
Member
monksilouan  Offline
Member

Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 543
tornado alley
I sincerely pray that the Lord will bless Father's ministry and lead many souls to the Heavenly Father.
Silouan, monk

Re: Cardinal George in Chicago Suspends Priest [Re: monksilouan] #364951
06/01/11 08:54 PM
06/01/11 08:54 PM
Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 13
near Leesburg VA
V
VA_country_gent Offline
Junior Member
VA_country_gent  Offline
Junior Member
V

Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 13
near Leesburg VA
If, as Cardinal George claimed, Father Pfleger did not want to spend his ministry at St. Sabina's, then went public with "the Cardinal is trying to remove ME," then Fr. Pfleger has been deceitful with his bishop. Being deceitful with a bishop or a superior (in the case of monk, nun or someone in a clerical order) is grounds for de-frocking. Cardinal George offered Fr. Pfleger a position at Leo High School, not a mandate. Then Fr. Pfleger goes public on NPR with that trash he said?? I wonder if the Church is better off without an egomaniac like that. I remember the embarassing spectacle Cardinal Hickey went through with then-Father George Augustus Stallings, Jr., who now claims to be a Patriarch of all things.

Page 1 of 2 1 2

Moderated by  Father Anthony 

The Byzantine Forum provides message boards for discussions focusing on Eastern Christianity (though discussions of other topics are welcome). The views expressed herein are those of the participants and may or may not reflect the teachings of the Byzantine Catholic or any other Church. The Byzantine Forum and the www.byzcath.org site exist to help build up the Church but are unofficial, have no connection with any Church entity, and should not be looked to as a source for official information for any Church. All posts become property of byzcath.org. Contents copyright - 1996-2019 (Forum 1998-2019). All rights reserved.
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.1
(Release build 20190129)
PHP: 7.1.32 Page Time: 0.029s Queries: 15 (0.008s) Memory: 2.6424 MB (Peak: 2.7578 MB) Data Comp: Zlib Server Time: 2019-09-18 01:22:10 UTC