Dear Andrew,

Yes, I said that many Fatimist groups say that!

But not all and that is not the only interpretation of Fatima that can be had. But because of the negativity surrounding that, the traditional view on Fatima is what rules the day and it can be a sore point to be sure.

But I like Alice's take on it and it is the one I share.

In the Ukrainian Catholic Church, there isn't even an assigned feast-day for Our Lady of Fatima and apart from private devotion, it does not enter into the liturgical cursus in our Church.

Alex

"Fr." Mary,

How dare you come on here and ask us sarcastically if we are using a Latinized Typikon or are we lax in fasting?

You dare accuse us of not being as pure as you and your monks.

To strashne. Rozumiyesh?

Get out of Ukraine. Don't ever go back. Stop saying OUR Divine Liturgies. Your "work" in Ukraine is evil. You comming on here and arrogantly chiding us is counterproductive as well.

Just because you think you follow a Russian Typikon makes you such a great person. The Great Fast is for humility, my friend.

You wish to be your hybrid, authentic Orthodox in practice, but you hate them. I just cannot believe such evil exists.

You remind me of the Pharisee, not the Publican.

-uc

DEar UC,

That really isn't nice, brate!

Alex

Alex,

I know. It's gone.

-uc

Dear Fr. Michael Mary,

As for fasting, I do follow the Orthodox typicon in conjunction with the guidance of my Confessor and the forum Administrator here.

Your questions about WHY people should fast betray a kind of judgementalism of the Ukrainian people that simply does not become you!

As for ecumenism, your visit with the Russian Archbishop truly WAS used by him to promote the Russian Orthodox Church agenda - whether you wish to admit it or not, your visit was used precisely in that way, as one can read on the site: www.orthodox.org.ua

The impression is created that the Russian Archbishop was opening ecumenical talks with you and your movement. Is this not why you came here - to correct the record in this regard?

So despite your position, you have indeed become part of ecumenical politics.

Is there someone in your group I could report you to?

Alex

Dear uc,

Duzhe dobre!

Chy ty dumayesh scho tsey svyaschennyk sam yakeysh "Zrusifikovaney Latynnyk?"

Nash narod dosit mav vid ushikh tykh drukhych Latinnikiv . . . a sche zrusifikovaney . . .

Kazhut scho yak kohosh Boh bazhaye pokaraty, to yomu naypershe rozum vidbere . . .

Ushoho dobroho!

Vash,

Olesh

Alex

Unlike Fr. Gruner’s group though, the FFA to my knowledge is mainstream and in normalized status regarding the church. It is pretty obvious what their agenda is, although I would say they are careful in their language. I can only couple that with comments I’m reading here, that I’ve read elsewhere on the site, and things I’ve heard elsewhere.

Personally I’m still convinced there is a concerted effort to convert people from Orthodox countries to Catholicism.

Andrew

Alex,

I thought you knew that I don't think Russia is converted, etc.

I do not deny any infallible Church Teaching! Why would you accuse me of that?

We are free to disagree on noninfallible Church teachings, of course.

Anyway, the only way one can "join" the SSPX is to become a priest of the Society. It is a sacerdotal society and has no lay members. There are SSPX priests and then there are faithful who attend their chapels; as Father said, it is not a parallel church! As I do not wish to become an SSPX priest, I really don't think I'm going to "join the SSPX."

Logos Teen

Dear Andrew,

I don't deny this - I believe this to be the case in fact and the RC missions in Russia are doing just that.

It shows the Latin Church is paying lip service to ecumenism with the Orthodox which is why I think Fr. Michael Mary and Teen Logos are wrong to criticize it in this regard . . .

Time for Lenten Vespers!

Cheers,

Alex

Dear Friends,

I have one question to ask here - is it my imagination or is there absolutely no reference on the Transalpine Redemptorists Site to their being in communion with Rome ?

Yes you, and I , all know that they are not - but do the innocent people who venture onto their most attractive Website realise this ?

Anhelyna

The Transalpines and the SSPX are NOT in the Catholic Church they are outside in their own Church. They are as outside the Catholic Church as the Mormons. That line from The Merchant of Venice about the devil being able to recite scripture, comes to mind in regards to the schismatic from Papa Stronsay. Teen if you hold such views as he does then then what are you doing in this forum. What you insist is the official Catholic Church line is not anything of the sort. Your posting here is extemely rude and offensive. Only recently you asked our prayers and yet all along you show a false peace, just like those who take their rot into Ukraine to divide our Church with their errors. Might be time to shake the dust of your sandals and give us the flick. We are still of course praying for you.

ICXC
NIKA

Would anyone like to consider that Fatima was a PRIVATE revelation, and that no one is required to believe any part of it? It is not official teaching or doctrine, regardless of how strongly anyone feels about it. All of us are free to believe it, or completely disregard it, as we see fit.

schism ( P ) Pronunciation Key (skzm, sz-)
n.
A separation or division into factions.

A formal breach of union within a Christian church.
The offense of attempting to produce such a breach.
Disunion; discord.


Is not the Orthodox Church separated from the Catholic Church? Then by that definition, they are in schism.

I agree with your definition, but the question is, who separated from whom? It is the belief in the East that the Roman Church separated Herself from the Catholic Church.

Alexandr

Dearest in Christ UC
Glory to Jesus Christ!
Our work is thankless: 'we are reviled, and we bless ... we are made the refuse of this world, the offscouring of all even until now.' (1 Cor IV:12) So, if needs be, let the invective flow: Rather than pour it on anyone else, help yourself to me.

I am surprised that you took offence by my asking about the Fasting Typikon. I was not being sarcastic and I asked the question humbly I wanted to know if my adversaries were truly interested in the one only thing: the salvation of his immortal soul; living the faith is the way to that and fasting is a touchstone to seriousness: putting your money where your mouth is......so to speak. It is truly a real issue. In my first posting I mentioned a nun who left the Catholic Church and became Orthodox because of her extreme disappointment with the UGCC. She never believed that either Latin or Greek Catholics really fasted. 'Only symbolical!' as another Oriental nun said to me. With this in mind I asked the hard question; no offence intended.

You may say that she is only one person, but in a way she is not. She represents many deeply Oriental Christian. She really fasts; and all the Orthodox that you meet in Ukraine and Russia really know how to fast. She is deeply Oriental. She was a noted orientalist of the UGCC before she went to Orthodoxy under the Moscow Patriarchate (and she does not want to be called Catholic now). She knows her Ukrainian history; she lived through attempts at the Russification of her beloved land. It was from her that the UGCC received the composition of the Akafist to Blessed Nicholas and she is the grand-niece of Blessed Martyr-Bishop Vasil. She has the heritage of a martyr in her blood; and unable to cope with the ongoing scandals she took what seemed to her to be the right option: we could say more,but enough. A tragic loss for her and for the UGCC.