Newest Members
SocietyOfStsP&A, Robert Pauly, RichE, Gene, erniedee1, Kklcz, DMB, Cyrillic, AzzurriFan, cousin janie, lovesupreme, Dill-Bro Baggins, SERA, Raul Urbina Moreno, JXD
4745 Registered Users
Who's Online
6 registered (Apotheoun, griego catolico, The young fogey, Sbdn. John, BAK, 1 invisible), 192 Guests and 1 Spider online.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Latest Photos
Great and Holy Week Our Lady of Fatima SF
Blessing of Fr. Serge Keleher's tombstone. April 7, 2013
Sts. Cyril and Methodius Byzantine Catholic Church
Holy Ghost Orthodox Church Phoenixville, PA
Theophany 2013
Forum Stats
4745 Members
26 Forums
31700 Topics
387840 Posts

Max Online: 2716 @ 06/07/12 04:10 PM
Page 2 of 2 < 1 2
Topic Options
#378070 - 03/26/12 07:46 PM Re: Russian Catholic Old Believers [Re: Nelson Chase]
John of Patmos Offline
Member

Registered: 03/15/12
Posts: 42
Loc: Earth
Is the Russian Catholic Old Believers movement pretty much dead, since it looks like all there parishes are civilly suppressed...

Top
#378089 - 03/27/12 08:12 AM Re: Russian Catholic Old Believers [Re: Nelson Chase]
Irish Melkite Offline
Global Moderator
Member

Registered: 10/27/03
Posts: 9548
Loc: Massachusetts
John,

There is presently a single parish in Russia in which a priest of the Russian Greek Catholic Church serves according to the Old Rituals. They never represented more than a very small number of the faithful in a small Church - they were likely never more than 1200 or so faithful (852 adults came into communion with Father Patapios, a smaller number with Father Eustachios).

Many years,

Neil
_________________________
"One day all our ethnic traits ... will have disappeared. Time itself is seeing to this. And so we can not think of our communities as ethnic parishes, ... unless we wish to assure the death of our community."

Top
#378100 - 03/27/12 09:48 PM Re: Russian Catholic Old Believers [Re: Irish Melkite]
Diak Offline
Member

Registered: 03/24/02
Posts: 7399
Loc: Kansas/UGCC
Quote:
According to Pavel Parfentiev's biography of Mother Catherine Abrikosova, T.O.P., Father Yevstafii Susalev converted to Catholicism as an informant for the Tsarist secret police. This did not become known until after the February Revolution. In retaliation, Blessed Leonid expelled Father Yevstafii from the Exarchate.


Exarch Andrei (Katkov) maintained that this was not true. Fr. Paul Mailleux, who had known some of the original Russian Catholics first-hand, also does not mention the "secret agent" theory at all in his biography (certainly the definitive one in English) of Exarch Leonid. With Fr. Paul's attention to historical detail I doubt greatly that if this was demonstrable he would have ommitted the evidence.

Top
#378105 - 03/28/12 01:58 PM Re: Russian Catholic Old Believers [Re: Diak]
Diak Offline
Member

Registered: 03/24/02
Posts: 7399
Loc: Kansas/UGCC
What Fr. Paul surmised based on his information was that Susalev attempted to return to Orthodoxy. While promoting himself to the Orthodox bishop Susalev proposed to provide information for proselytizing the specific members of the Russian Greek Catholic Church (he knew nearly all of them personally) back into the Muscovite Church. The bishop refused to accept Susalev. It almost surely wasn't some kind of secret plot; remember this was the same Susalev whom Mdme. Ushakova tried unsuccessfully to teach grammatically correct Russian so he wouldn't say such things as the equivalent of "we is" from the pulpit.

Top
#378112 - 03/28/12 04:22 PM Re: Russian Catholic Old Believers [Re: Diak]
Irish Melkite Offline
Global Moderator
Member

Registered: 10/27/03
Posts: 9548
Loc: Massachusetts
Originally Posted By: Diak
Fr. Paul Mailleux, who had known some of the original Russian Catholics first-hand, also does not mention the "secret agent" theory at all in his biography (certainly the definitive one in English) of Exarch Leonid.


Off-topic, but I noticed about a dozen English language copies of Father Mailleux' biography of Blessed Leonid available at AbeBooks about a week ago - most at reasonable prices. (About a half-dozen French language copies as well, as I recollect.)

Many years,

Neil
_________________________
"One day all our ethnic traits ... will have disappeared. Time itself is seeing to this. And so we can not think of our communities as ethnic parishes, ... unless we wish to assure the death of our community."

Top
#378121 - 03/28/12 06:43 PM Re: Russian Catholic Old Believers [Re: Irish Melkite]
Diak Offline
Member

Registered: 03/24/02
Posts: 7399
Loc: Kansas/UGCC
There aren't many left around, so grab them while you can. I've seen some in the $20 range.

Top
#378154 - 03/29/12 10:05 PM Re: Russian Catholic Old Believers [Re: Irish Melkite]
latinmasstrad Offline
Member

Registered: 06/15/09
Posts: 36
Loc: Saint Cloud, Minnesota
Dear Neil,
Pavel Parfentiev bases this upon his research in the archives of the Tsarist secret police. He accuses Father Yevstafii of fingering at least two Russian Catholic priests to the Okhrana. I read it within his 2004 biography of Mother Ekaterina Abrikosova, T.O.P.
In Christ,
Brendan

Top
#378158 - 03/30/12 12:24 AM Re: Russian Catholic Old Believers [Re: latinmasstrad]
Diak Offline
Member

Registered: 03/24/02
Posts: 7399
Loc: Kansas/UGCC
Whatever the precise historical truth is, be that a paid proselytizer or a paid informant (or both), Fr. Evstachy is not likely be forwarded for beatification.

Top
#379207 - 04/25/12 05:03 PM Re: Russian Catholic Old Believers [Re: Nelson Chase]
latinmasstrad Offline
Member

Registered: 06/15/09
Posts: 36
Loc: Saint Cloud, Minnesota
I have recently started writing an article about the life of Fr. Potapy Emelyanov. I would be very grateful for any prayers for its successful completion.

Top
#379235 - 04/26/12 08:42 AM Re: Russian Catholic Old Believers [Re: Nelson Chase]
Irish Melkite Offline
Global Moderator
Member

Registered: 10/27/03
Posts: 9548
Loc: Massachusetts
Brendan,

Prayers for success in your article.

Many years,

Neil
_________________________
"One day all our ethnic traits ... will have disappeared. Time itself is seeing to this. And so we can not think of our communities as ethnic parishes, ... unless we wish to assure the death of our community."

Top
Page 2 of 2 < 1 2



Moderator:  Father Anthony 

The Byzantine Forum provides message boards for discussions focusing on Eastern Christianity (though discussions of other topics are welcome). The views expressed herein are those of the participants and may or may not reflect the teachings of the Byzantine Catholic or any other Church. The Byzantine Forum and the www.byzcath.org site exist to help build up the Church but are unofficial, have no connection with any Church entity, and should not be looked to as a source for official information for any Church. Contents copyright - 1996-2013. All rights reserved.