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#383452 - 07/27/12 04:28 PM Re: Un-Orthodox [Re: Peter J]
Roman Interloper Offline
Member

Registered: 05/20/12
Posts: 324
Loc: New York
Originally Posted By: Peter J
Hmm ... in retrospect, that seems more tiresome than humorous.

RI, I wonder if it would help the discussion if you elaborate on how you understand the term spiritual direction. (It might not, but it might.)


I suppose I have in mind a compare and contrast sort of thing involving direction or advice that I've received from RC priests (or Catholic apologists or just Catholic friends)that doesn't quite always necessarily seem to make a great deal of sense. Not to me, at any rate. I'm beginning to perceive, however, that Orthodoxy often views a number of matters ia a profoundly different way than do Roman Catholics...and much as I fear to say it, the Eastern take on things can seem to resonate with me more so than the Roman Catholic perspective.

So, I suppose I'd like to, perhaps, sit down with an Orthodox clergyman and say, "well, Father, regarding such-and-such issue, the Roman Catholic sensibility seems to say the answer/solution/method/consequence is so-and-so, but I wondered what sort of insights or advice an Orthodox priest might share with one of his own flock." That sort of thing. I certainly don't mean anything approaching the Sacrament of Reconciliation, but I'm not talking about a purely academic conversation either.

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#383454 - 07/27/12 04:57 PM Re: Un-Orthodox [Re: Roman Interloper]
Peter J Offline
Member

Registered: 02/21/05
Posts: 808
Loc: New England
It's possible that no one can truly answer this question for you. Perhaps only you can really decide. It may, of course, be fine; but it may be a kind of misguided ecumenism.

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#383457 - 07/27/12 05:59 PM Re: Un-Orthodox [Re: Nelson Chase]
Roman Interloper Offline
Member

Registered: 05/20/12
Posts: 324
Loc: New York
Originally Posted By: Nelson Chase
RI,

You have your answer and no matter who tells you otherwise it seems that your mind is made up.


Good afternoon to you, too. Thanks for the judgmental swipe; that's fabulous. I have different answers from different people, it seems...which is just what I'm looking for...and I haven't made up my mind one way or the other; I'm right on the fence at the moment. But I certainly appreciate your input.

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#383459 - 07/27/12 06:28 PM Re: Un-Orthodox [Re: Roman Interloper]
Nelson Chase Offline
Member

Registered: 01/13/09
Posts: 745
Loc: The threshold of Fatherhood
Quote:
Thanks for the judgmental swipe; that's fabulous.


Forgive me if it came off judgmental for I certainly didn't mean it that way nor was it a swipe at you. From my observation, which I admit could be wrong, it seems like you had made up your mind. Again, forgive me if I was wrong.

I think Irish-Melkite sums up my view.

Quote:
If I'm not mistaken, we very, very, recently had a thread on this very topic in one of the fora. Anyone remember where it is?

James,

You can expect to receive very little discouragement from members of this forum as regards seeking out advice, counsel, or spiritual direction from clergy of any of the Apostolic Churches.

Many years,

Neil


An Orthodox priest is a priest of the One, Holy, Catholic, and Apostolic Church (just as is an Oriental Orthodox, Roman Catholic, and Eastern/Oriental Catholic priest) and while sadly we can't receive the sacraments from each other that does not mean that a layman can't receive guidance and ask questions from a priest of Christ's body- the Church. But those are just my rambling thoughts.


Edited by Nelson Chase (07/27/12 06:34 PM)

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#383625 - 07/31/12 08:34 PM Re: Un-Orthodox [Re: Nelson Chase]
Roman Interloper Offline
Member

Registered: 05/20/12
Posts: 324
Loc: New York
Originally Posted By: Nelson Chase
Forgive me if it came off judgmental for I certainly didn't mean it that way nor was it a swipe at you. From my observation, which I admit could be wrong, it seems like you had made up your mind. Again, forgive me if I was wrong.


Don't sweat it. I responded harshly. I offer my apologies, as well.

Peace,

James

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#384078 - 08/09/12 06:41 AM Re: Un-Orthodox [Re: Roman Interloper]
ConstantineTG Offline
Member

Registered: 10/03/10
Posts: 308
Loc: At the Eastern Crossroads
Wow, this thread is like talking to a mirror.

I second Michael Thoma, go for it.

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#384082 - 08/09/12 12:08 PM Re: Un-Orthodox [Re: Roman Interloper]
Lester S Offline
Member

Registered: 06/25/12
Posts: 168
Loc: Oregon, USA
Originally Posted By: Roman Interloper
Originally Posted By: Peter J
Hmm ... in retrospect, that seems more tiresome than humorous.

RI, I wonder if it would help the discussion if you elaborate on how you understand the term spiritual direction. (It might not, but it might.)


I suppose I have in mind a compare and contrast sort of thing involving direction or advice that I've received from RC priests (or Catholic apologists or just Catholic friends)that doesn't quite always necessarily seem to make a great deal of sense. Not to me, at any rate. I'm beginning to perceive, however, that Orthodoxy often views a number of matters ia a profoundly different way than do Roman Catholics...and much as I fear to say it, the Eastern take on things can seem to resonate with me more so than the Roman Catholic perspective.

So, I suppose I'd like to, perhaps, sit down with an Orthodox clergyman and say, "well, Father, regarding such-and-such issue, the Roman Catholic sensibility seems to say the answer/solution/method/consequence is so-and-so, but I wondered what sort of insights or advice an Orthodox priest might share with one of his own flock." That sort of thing. I certainly don't mean anything approaching the Sacrament of Reconciliation, but I'm not talking about a purely academic conversation either.


I feel the same way, James. As I explained, in CAF, I've been getting multiple hints regarding the priesthood (A friend of mine just blurted it, right after we were leaving a First Friday Rosary session, for life. This was one of a handful of hints. Either way, I thought about the direction I would need, in discernment over if it was truly my calling, or not. At that moment, I realized I needed a Spiritual Father. There was a Roman priest I got to know for the year I attended a Roman church. But, in light of my decision to dedicate myself to things Byzantine, I'm not sure if this would help me in this venture.

The other priest, who presides over the Byzantine church I go to, is a bi-ritual priest. He's a great guy, but he's seemingly a little hard to get a hold out of, outside of church. But, I can't complain, I've got pre, and post liturgy to discuss things.

This aside, my prejudiced apprehensions over the former stems from the difference in theological perspective; and his take on priesthood, with respect to the Latin rite tradition.

There's the new priest at the same Roman church, but I find the fact he's only a year older than me a little concerning. I guess, I'm of the mindset: with age, comes experience.

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#384090 - 08/09/12 02:42 PM Re: Un-Orthodox [Re: Roman Interloper]
Diak Offline
Member

Registered: 03/24/02
Posts: 7399
Loc: Kansas/UGCC
Quote:
Where I live, all the Eastern Rite Catholic clergy are from the old country and English is their second language, making communication a challenge at times.

Didn't you mention in another thread that you attended St. Basil's in Lancaster? Fr. Roberto is completely fluent in English.

Francois is indeed correct in saying that spiritual fatherhood is closely linked to the Holy Mysteries, especially Confession and Communion. My experience is basically the same as his; while having many edifying and instructive conversations this premise always remains.

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#384094 - 08/09/12 03:12 PM Re: Un-Orthodox [Re: Diak]
Roman Interloper Offline
Member

Registered: 05/20/12
Posts: 324
Loc: New York
Originally Posted By: Diak
Quote:
Where I live, all the Eastern Rite Catholic clergy are from the old country and English is their second language, making communication a challenge at times.

Didn't you mention in another thread that you attended St. Basil's in Lancaster? Fr. Roberto is completely fluent in English.



Yes, however I posted that observation before I had the opportunity to hear Father Moreno speak (The Feast of the Transfiguration was my first experience with him as a celebrant). I gather, however, from his accent, that English is not his first language, either, and so my observation obtains. Granted, as you say, Fr. Moreno is clearly fluent in English and it actually occurred to me to approach him for consultation. I'd like to give it some time, however, rather than just appear out of nowhere (as I have done) and say, "Hi. Be my spiritual director".

He gives a very good sermon, incidentally.

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#384100 - 08/09/12 04:36 PM Re: Un-Orthodox [Re: Roman Interloper]
chadrook Offline
Member

Registered: 07/28/08
Posts: 226
Loc: kansas
This is an interesting thread. It raises some questions though. At the start of the thread the question was asked if he could approach an Orthodox Priest to talk to about "things."

In Orthodoxy, one should never act without a blessing. That being said, do Catholics ask for a blessing? Why wouldn't he ask for a blessing from his Priest/Confessor first?

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#384103 - 08/09/12 04:42 PM Re: Un-Orthodox [Re: Roman Interloper]
StuartK Online   content
Member

Registered: 11/09/01
Posts: 6914
Loc: Falls Church, VA
His Holiness, Pope John Paul II, Pope of Rome, in his Apostolic Letter Orientale Lumen, and his Encyclical Ut Unum Sint, exhorted the Catholic faithful both to discover and gain appreciation for the treasures of the Eastern Churches, but also to engage the Orthodox Church in a dialogue of both truth and love. To this end, Catholics are not only permitted, but encouraged, to join with their Orthodox brethren in prayer and to ask questions to further mutual understanding, for there can be no dialogue unless we speak together.

Such scrupulosity I find both foolish and infuriating. If we can with confidence and without condemnation dare to call God "Father", then certainly we can with confidence and without condemnation ask a presbyter of a Sister Church a simple question.

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#384109 - 08/09/12 05:40 PM Re: Un-Orthodox [Re: chadrook]
Utroque Offline
Member

Registered: 09/23/06
Posts: 354
Loc: Kennebunk, Maine
Quote:
In Orthodoxy, one should never act without a blessing. That being said, do Catholics ask for a blessing? Why wouldn't he ask for a blessing from his Priest/Confessor first?


Stuart is more than correct here. I do not think a mature Catholic needs any more blessings on this issue than those that come from a pope in an encyclical letter and the Second Vatican Council. This scrupulosity is foolish and unwarranted. Unfortunately, many western-rite Catholic priests would be confused by the inquiry, and it is best to go it alone knowing you stand on solid ground.

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#384118 - 08/09/12 06:17 PM Re: Un-Orthodox [Re: Roman Interloper]
chadrook Offline
Member

Registered: 07/28/08
Posts: 226
Loc: kansas
Oh I see, self directed spirituality. Sounds like Prelest to me. What is wrong with answering a simple question?

Stuart, I guess the Pope is your confessor and knows the state you are in? Don't dance around the question. Bringing up some psychological disorder is deflecting and insulting.

If not, then forgive me a sinner, there is some very big differences in understanding.

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#384121 - 08/09/12 06:51 PM Re: Un-Orthodox [Re: Roman Interloper]
Utroque Offline
Member

Registered: 09/23/06
Posts: 354
Loc: Kennebunk, Maine
I do not think Stuart and I are delusional about our relationship with God. We do have Christ's promise that He is in our midst. Your question has been simply answered. You have an ecclesial blessing to freely associate with the Orthodox, clergy and laity alike.


Edited by Utroque (08/09/12 06:52 PM)

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#384125 - 08/09/12 07:42 PM Re: Un-Orthodox [Re: Lester S]
countertenor Offline
Member

Registered: 02/19/07
Posts: 76
Loc: Oregon
Just ask Fr. Frank for his phone number. He is generally willing to take calls any time at home, and will chat you up for hours.

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