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Jack Matlock, who was U.S. ambassador to the Soviet Union during the period of its dissolution, has an interesting article on Time here.

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In the thread, " Another Example of Russia's "Charity" Toward the UGCC", I noted the irony in Father Kvych's comment that: "I am most hurt that we never really cared to make the region Ukrainian. For example, in the large cities there is only one Ukrainian school. In Sevastopol, there are no Ukrainian schools, only Ukrainian classes. Ukrainian authorities did nothing to make Crimea Ukrainian."

It would seem that others may have noted the same irony.


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It certainly would make you wonder exactly how Ukrainian the region was to begin with.

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AMM,

There are all sorts of regions in Russia that are not "Russian" ethnically.

Perhaps they should separate from Russia or be annexed by other neighbouring countries?

Alex

Last edited by Orthodox Catholic; 03/25/14 03:45 PM.
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Dear DMD,

Russia did plenty to Russify and "De-Tatarize" Crimea which is the Tatars' homeland, as we know.

This only points to the fact that Russia, as an imperial power, is very much about control, colonization and hegemony.

Perhaps Ukrainians should be more like Russia in this respect.

Alex

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I agree that Ukraine is better off without Crimea.

It is also better off without the Russian imperial yoke.

Time will tell about that.

The Russian foreign minister wants Ukraine to be a country of autonomous regions.

Again, they want to tell another country how it should be organized.

Alex

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Using the concept of Russky Mir to justify Russian ambition in the 21st century probably appeals to the type who liked 19th and early 20th century imperialism, you remember, the Indian Raj, Colonial Africa , the British Mandate and all of that...Or as Kipling called it....'the white man's burden.' Most of the rest of the world, excepting some in the United States and Russia apparently, no longer believe in a manifest destiny or a 'Divine Burden to reign God's Empire on Earth'.

The fact that some still do makes the current situation frightening.

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Originally Posted by Orthodox Catholic
AMM,

There are all sorts of regions in Russia that are not "Russian" ethnically.

Perhaps they should separate from Russia or be annexed by other neighbouring countries?

Alex


That is a danger of the game they're playing. They're fighting a full blown Islamic insurgency for example against a people that clearly don't want to be part of the Russian Federation, however that situation presents just as much of a conundrum for us given the line between insurgency and terror is pretty murky.

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I wanted to thank AMM and DMD for their contributions on a subject that is particularly painful for me to even think about, much less talk about.

Alex

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Originally Posted by Orthodox Catholic
I wanted to thank AMM and DMD for their contributions on a subject that is particularly painful for me to even think about, much less talk about.

Alex


Honestly I don't think I've added much, but thanks. I don't have a stake in all of this being thousands of miles away, I am not Russian or Ukrainian, have never been to Ukraine, no family involved, etc. I am also not any side. I would like for their to be peace for all the people involved.

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Originally Posted by AMM
I would like for their to be peace for all the people involved.


Amen.

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Slava Isusu Khrestu

I wanted to post this in a new topic but I didn't know how frown so I'll post it here


Moscow Patriarchate slams Ukrainian Catholic 'Uniates' for "meddling" in politics and taking a pro-West stance
by Nina Achmatova
Metropolitan Hilarion, head of the Department for External Church Relations, slams Catholic Archbishop Sviatoslav Shevchuk of Kyiv for his positions. He also says he asked the Holy See for explanations. Diplomacy is faltering over the religious divisions.

Moscow (AsiaNews) - The Moscow Patriarchate strongly condemned the Greek-Catholic (Uniate) Church in Ukraine for "meddling" in politics, in the current crisis in the country. For its part, Russia continues to accuse the Ukraine of "religious intolerance," a charge the latter sharply rejects, noting instead how all religious denominations have come together to oppose violence and express support for Europe.

For Metropolitan Hilarion, head of the Synodal Department for External Church Relations of the Moscow Patriarchate, Sviatoslav Shevchuk, major archbishop of the Ukrainian Greek Catholic Church, and his predecessor, Lubomyr Husar, took a "very clear position from the beginning of the civil conflict, which grew unfortunately into an armed bloody conflict".

In his view, the Uniates not only advocated integration with Europe, "but even called for Western countries to intervene more decisively in the situation in Ukraine."

Speaking on The Church and the world, a programme on the Russia-24 TV channel, Hilarion also noted that "Archbishop Sviatoslav Shevchuk and [. . .] Filaret (Denisenko) even went to the United States, [. . .] to the State Department and asked for US intervention in Ukrainian affairs."

Excommunicated by the Moscow Patriarchate, Filaret is the head of the breakaway Ukrainian Orthodox Church-Kyiv Patriarchate.

In early February, Archbishop Shevchuk spoke before the US Congress. On that occasion, he said that the Ukraine situation transcended politics and asked for US mediation to resolve the crisis.

Conversely, for Hilarion, the Greek-Catholic Church is a major obstacle in relations between the Moscow Patriarchate and the Holy See.

The Orthodox, he said, have always perceived the Uniates in a very negative light, "as a special project by the Catholic Church," because "they dress like Orthodox, follow Orthodox rituals, but are in fact Catholic," which gives them and the Vatican a certain leeway.

When he asked a Catholic official for an explanation about the show of support from the Greek-Catholic Church for the breakaway Orthodox Church, the only answer Hilarion said he got was "We do not control them."

For his part, Shevchuk, who recently met with Pope Francis, bemoans the disappearances of people in Ukraine, who were "abducted and tortured" by the Berkut, the special police in the government of ousted president Yanukovych.

Moscow and Kyiv also continue to trade barbs over religion. The Ukrainian Ministry of Culture has rejected Russian accusations of "religious intolerance" with regards to alleged threats and seizure of parishes that are under the jurisdiction of the Moscow Patriarchate in Ukraine.

According to the ministry's Religious Affairs Department, no such actions have taken place. On the contrary, during protests at Maiden (Independence) Square, "all the churches, including the Ukrainian Orthodox Church," came out to defend the people and show their support for a pro-European orientation in the country's development.

Likewise, Kyiv has denied claims by the Moscow Patriarchate and the Russian government that the country is in a civil war.

Instead, Russia continues to be under diplomatic pressure to avoid a wider Ukrainian crisis, following its annexation of the Crimea.

In fact, US President Barack Obama is in Brussels for a summit with EU leaders Barroso and Van Rompuy to discuss possible new sanctions.
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