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Inviting Orthodox Bishops to help run the Catholic Church #407313 08/03/14 11:45 PM
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Dcn Anton Offline OP
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Interesting news from The Tablet:

Quote
Pope Francis ‘is plotting a path to unity’ and could invite Orthodox to help run the Church, says new aide Enzo Bianchi
01 August 2014 13:10 by Hannah Roberts in Rome

Pope Francis wants to reform the papacy to allow greater unity between the Catholic and Orthodox Churches, a newly appointed senior adviser has claimed.

Enzo Bianchi, appointed on 22 July as consultor of the Pontifical Council for Promoting Christian Unity, said the Pope could allow a council of bishops including Orthodox bishops to assist in governing the Church.

Reform of the Synod of Bishops and the growth of synodality within the Catholic Church would greatly enhance the opportunity for union between Rome and the Orthodox Churches, by making the papacy less “monarchical” and the Catholic Church less centralised.

Bianchi, Prior of the Bose monastery in north-east Italy, said: “I believe that the Pope wants to achieve unity by reforming the papacy.” Pope Francis feels that union with the Orthodox Churches in particular is “an urgent goal”, he emphasised. “I believe that the Pope has one particular concern, that unity should not be achieved in the spirituality of unity but rather it is a command by Christ which we must carry out,” he told the Italian daily La Stampa.

Reform would involve a new balance between collegiality and primacy, Bianchi explained. “The Orthodox have synodality, but not primacy. We Catholics have primacy but a lack of synodality.”

“It is conceivable that we could have an episcopal body that helps the Pope in governing the Church without calling into question his primacy,” Bianchi said. “This would help to create a new style of papal primacy and the government of bishops.”

Pope Paul VI’s Nota Praevia, attached to the Dogmatic Constitution on the Church, Lumen Gentium, ensured that none of the document’s teaching on collegiality or the Synod of Bishops should impact on the rights and privileges of the Pope. The Synod of Bishops therefore remains a solely consultative body and relies on papal endorsement.

Last year Pope Francis suggested strengthening the Synod saying it was a “half-baked” development of the Second Vatican Council.

Re: Inviting Orthodox Bishops to help run the Catholic Church [Re: Dcn Anton] #407319 08/04/14 09:03 AM
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Economos Roman V. Russo Offline
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Pope Paul VI's Nota Praevia should be a deal-breaker for any talk of beatification!


Re: Inviting Orthodox Bishops to help run the Catholic Church [Re: Dcn Anton] #407325 08/04/14 01:36 PM
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Epiphanius Offline
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Deacon Anton,

Thanks for sharing this--it certainly looks like a major step in the right direction. It's been said before that actually working together is more effective at building unity than simply discussing matters of theology, so clearly working together on the episcopal level would be the most effective way possible. grin

I imagine the Orthodox bishops would be working much the way they did at Vatican II, observing the proceedings and offering their comments. Now, this may seem a bit lame, but if the RC bishops take their comments seriously--as I expect they will--the results will be awesome.

Quote
Pope Paul VI’s Nota Praevia, attached to the Dogmatic Constitution on the Church, Lumen Gentium, ensured that none of the document’s teaching on collegiality or the Synod of Bishops should impact on the rights and privileges of the Pope. The Synod of Bishops therefore remains a solely consultative body and relies on papal endorsement.
Originally Posted by Ot'ets Nastoiatel'
Pope Paul VI's Nota Praevia should be a deal-breaker for any talk of beatification!

Perhaps, but then they were able to beatify Pope Pius IX just a few years ago ... wink


Peace,
Deacon Richard

Re: Inviting Orthodox Bishops to help run the Catholic Church [Re: Dcn Anton] #407329 08/04/14 07:00 PM
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Peter J Offline
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Originally Posted by Dcn Anton

Quote
Pope Francis ‘is plotting a path to unity’ and could invite Orthodox to help run the Church, says new aide Enzo Bianchi

I wish Mr Bianchi were on the forum, so I could ask whether he means with or without becoming Catholic. (And yes I did read the whole article -- just in case anyone is going to ask. cool)

Re: Inviting Orthodox Bishops to help run the Catholic Church [Re: Peter J] #407343 08/05/14 09:39 AM
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Epiphanius Offline
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Originally Posted by Peter J
Originally Posted by Dcn Anton
Quote
Pope Francis ‘is plotting a path to unity’ and could invite Orthodox to help run the Church, says new aide Enzo Bianchi

I wish Mr Bianchi were on the forum, so I could ask whether he means with or without becoming Catholic. (And yes I did read the whole article -- just in case anyone is going to ask. cool)

Peter,

It seems clear enough to me that "helping" to run the Church isn't the same as actually running it, and that Orthodox bishops could certainly advise and otherwise help Catholic bishops without actually becoming Catholic.


Peace,
Deacon Richard

Re: Inviting Orthodox Bishops to help run the Catholic Church [Re: Dcn Anton] #407345 08/05/14 11:19 AM
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Epiphanius Offline
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A little bit more about Enzo Bianchi:
Enzo Bianchi, Prior of Bose

He is a monastic, and the founder of the Bose priory, but apparently not a priest--they refer to him as br. Enzo Bianchi, or simply as Enzo Bianchi. (What is the proper title for a prior, anyway?)


Peace,
Deacon Richard

Re: Inviting Orthodox Bishops to help run the Catholic Church [Re: Epiphanius] #407348 08/05/14 02:21 PM
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This community's ecumenical Martyrology is, in a word, magnificent!

I will use it in my private devotions from now on.

Thank you for sharing this gem!

Alex

Re: Inviting Orthodox Bishops to help run the Catholic Church [Re: Epiphanius] #407356 08/06/14 08:16 AM
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As a preeminent Eastern Catholic historical theologian put it to me some years back, "If Pius IX is a beatus, then I'm an astronaut." To that I would append this list of αναξιοι: Pope John Paul II, Cardinal Stepinac, Josemaria Escriba de Balaguer for openers.

Re: Inviting Orthodox Bishops to help run the Catholic Church [Re: Economos Roman V. Russo] #407360 08/06/14 11:28 AM
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Epiphanius Offline
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Originally Posted by Ot'ets Nastoiatel'
As a preeminent Eastern Catholic historical theologian put it to me some years back, "If Pius IX is a beatus, then I'm an astronaut." To that I would append this list of αναξιοι: Pope John Paul II, Cardinal Stepinac, Josemaria Escriba de Balaguer for openers.

Didn't St. Cyril of Alexandria have some choice words (harsher than anaxios, as I recall) for the former metropolitan of Constantinople, the one we now call St. John Chrysostom?

Re: Inviting Orthodox Bishops to help run the Catholic Church [Re: Economos Roman V. Russo] #407364 08/06/14 03:59 PM
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Originally Posted by Ot'ets Nastoiatel'
As a preeminent Eastern Catholic historical theologian put it to me some years back, "If Pius IX is a beatus, then I'm an astronaut." To that I would append this list of αναξιοι: Pope John Paul II, Cardinal Stepinac, Josemaria Escriba de Balaguer for openers.


Perhaps you might add to that list the son of St. Helena, the God-fearing emperor saint, equal-to-the-Apostles, Constantine; or is he too shrouded in Byzantine incense? I'll take Jean d'Arc any day. Ora pro nobis, pecatoribus!

Re: Inviting Orthodox Bishops to help run the Catholic Church [Re: Epiphanius] #407368 08/06/14 08:33 PM
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Originally Posted by Epiphanius
Originally Posted by Peter J
I wish Mr Bianchi were on the forum, so I could ask whether he means with or without becoming Catholic. (And yes I did read the whole article -- just in case anyone is going to ask. cool)

Peter,

It seems clear enough to me that "helping" to run the Church isn't the same as actually running it, and that Orthodox bishops could certainly advise and otherwise help Catholic bishops without actually becoming Catholic.


Peace,
Deacon Richard

Exactly. The author may have meant without actually becoming Catholic (but doesn't make it clear).

Re: Inviting Orthodox Bishops to help run the Catholic Church [Re: Peter J] #407369 08/06/14 09:34 PM
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Originally Posted by Peter J
Originally Posted by Epiphanius
It seems clear enough to me that "helping" to run the Church isn't the same as actually running it, and that Orthodox bishops could certainly advise and otherwise help Catholic bishops without actually becoming Catholic.

Exactly. The author may have meant without actually becoming Catholic (but doesn't make it clear).

Peter,

Let me try this again. What I said was it seems clear enough to me, so YES, I think Brother Enzo is saying WITHOUT becoming Catholic--clearly, with no ambiguity, no uncertainty, no confusion of any kind.

Perhaps you're picking up something here that I'm not, but my point is that the article would have a completely different tone if it were saying anything else.


Peace,
Deacon Richard

Re: Inviting Orthodox Bishops to help run the Catholic Church [Re: Epiphanius] #407370 08/06/14 09:56 PM
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Deacon Richard,

I think I'm the one to blame here. I actually agree with you that "helping" to run the Church isn't the same as actually running it, and that Orthodox bishops could advise and otherwise help Catholic bishops without actually becoming Catholic. As far as your other statement, "I think Brother Enzo is saying WITHOUT becoming Catholic", it was never my intention to deny your right to your opinion, I only intended to express my own.

My apologies if I offended you.

Re: Inviting Orthodox Bishops to help run the Catholic Church [Re: Epiphanius] #407371 08/06/14 10:29 PM
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Peter J Offline
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Originally Posted by Epiphanius
Originally Posted by Peter J
Originally Posted by Epiphanius
It seems clear enough to me that "helping" to run the Church isn't the same as actually running it, and that Orthodox bishops could certainly advise and otherwise help Catholic bishops without actually becoming Catholic.

Exactly. The author may have meant without actually becoming Catholic (but doesn't make it clear).

Peter,

Let me try this again. What I said was it seems clear enough to me, so YES, I think Brother Enzo is saying WITHOUT becoming Catholic--clearly, with no ambiguity, no uncertainty, no confusion of any kind.

Perhaps you're picking up something here that I'm not, but my point is that the article would have a completely different tone if it were saying anything else.


Peace,
Deacon Richard

P.S. After thinking about this a bit more, I realize it would probably be more accurate to say that I did offend you rather than "if i offended you". That's not something I seek to do, to you or to anyone, but I don't think it's an issue since I wasn't planning to post more on this thread anyhow beyond my original point.

Peace and God bless,
Peter Jericho.

Re: Inviting Orthodox Bishops to help run the Catholic Church [Re: Peter J] #407374 08/06/14 10:51 PM
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Dear Peter,

Remember what happened to the walls of Jericho - keep firm, my friend!

Alex

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