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RC Holy Day of Obligation/Eastern Solemn Day #413947 12/07/15 07:50 PM
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Anna Offline OP
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Can a Roman Catholic fulfill a holy day obligation in an Eastern Catholic Church if that particular feast is "Solemn?" For example, Immaculate Conception is a HDO in the Latin Church but the Maternity of St Anna is a Solemn feast on the same day...

Re: RC Holy Day of Obligation/Eastern Solemn Day [Re: Anna] #413948 12/07/15 09:40 PM
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Paul B Offline
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Yes. Otherwise one is splitting hairs. A holyday of obligation is like a Sunday....or should be. A day of rest and honor to God.

Re: RC Holy Day of Obligation/Eastern Solemn Day [Re: Anna] #413949 12/07/15 09:53 PM
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My previous post could have been better. Please allow me to expand on it.

Major holy days are commemorated and celebrated to remind us of events on which we should reflect and which strengthen our faith. For this feast in particular we are reminded that God has a plan for everyone, you and me, as well as for Anna and Joachim and for the miraculous and most pure fruit of Anna's womb. Through God's plan the Mother of God was conceived and God's merciful plan of salvation accelerated.
We should give thanks for God's mercy and it should give us confidence that God's actions overcome any obstacle. it really destroys any excuses that we have as to why we should not follow God's will.
For this we give thanks for God's energies with which He has blessed us. What better way to praise God than at Divine Liturgy or Mass.

Re: RC Holy Day of Obligation/Eastern Solemn Day [Re: Paul B] #413951 12/07/15 10:18 PM
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Orthodox Catholic Offline
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It would be best if we would celebrate solemn holy-days in our own Particular Churches/parishes, unless there is a very pressing reason why we cannot do otherwise.

The spiritual emphasis on the Eastern "Conception of St Anne" is different from that of the "Immaculate Conception," especially via the different understanding of Original Sin.

Alex


Re: RC Holy Day of Obligation/Eastern Solemn Day [Re: Orthodox Catholic] #413954 12/08/15 06:56 AM
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You fulfill your obligation even if the particular Church you are attending is not celebrating the feast of precept. For instance, in several Western European countries, All Saints (November 1) is a day of precept; of course this feast is not observed on November 1 in Eastern Churches. Nevertheless, if you were to attend a Divine Liturgy on that day, your obligation is satisfied:

"Can. 1248 ยง1. A person who assists at a Mass celebrated anywhere in a Catholic rite either on the feast day itself or in the evening of the preceding day satisfies the obligation of participating in the Mass."

The term "Mass" reflects the Latin character of the Code and does not imply that a Divine Liturgy, Holy Qurbono, Soorp Badarak, etc., would not satisfy the obligation. The law also removes the requirement of fulfilling the obligation in one's own parish. In 1967, permission had been given to fulfill the obligation by attending Orthodox liturgies "occasionally," but the 1983 Code rescinded that permission.

Re: RC Holy Day of Obligation/Eastern Solemn Day [Re: Anna] #413957 12/08/15 10:54 AM
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Anna Offline OP
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Thank you for clarifying. I realize the East is less legalistic about such matters but this particular RC wishes to fulfill his obligation rightly according to his particular practice. He is not able to attend a RC Mass today.

Re: RC Holy Day of Obligation/Eastern Solemn Day [Re: Anna] #413960 12/08/15 01:00 PM
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Paul B Offline
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Anna,

Allow me to offer this perspective. June 29 is the Feast of Sts Peter and Paul and is a day of obligation for Byzantine Catholics, but is not for Romans. Would one argue that our obligation would not be met if we attended a Roman Catholic Mass that day?

How could one be more righteous if he attended neither?

Last edited by Paul B; 12/08/15 01:02 PM.
Re: RC Holy Day of Obligation/Eastern Solemn Day [Re: Paul B] #413978 12/09/15 11:08 PM
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Orthodox Catholic Offline
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Yes, obligations can be met in any Catholic Particular Church.

And, in this case, if one is not able to attend Mass in one's Latin Catholic parish or other parish - of course, no question.

But if one is a Latin Catholic and can get to a Latin Catholic parish, it is best to attend Mass on solemnities in one's own parish and spiritual tradition.

Again, the emphasis on the Western understanding of the Immaculate Conception is just not there in the EC Churches (unless it is a very Latinized EC parish).

There isn't all that great an emphasis on it, in its Latin form, in the EC parishes I'm familiar with - perhaps there is in the U.S., that is "ultra vires" my experience.

Alex

Re: RC Holy Day of Obligation/Eastern Solemn Day [Re: Paul B] #413979 12/09/15 11:17 PM
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Originally Posted by Paul B
Anna,

Allow me to offer this perspective. June 29 is the Feast of Sts Peter and Paul and is a day of obligation for Byzantine Catholics, but is not for Romans. Would one argue that our obligation would not be met if we attended a Roman Catholic Mass that day?

How could one be more righteous if he attended neither?


But I would say the same thing here as well. The understanding of the role of Peter in the EC Churches would be different from that in the RC Church.

The emphasis here on "obligation" is already a Latin import and non-starter to begin with. Eastern Catholics are called upon to attend the Divine Liturgy to celebrate ALL the major feasts of the Lord and of the Mother of God and the Forerunner throughout the year. And if our bishops have established "days of obligation" in imitation of the West, then EC's should just return to the original tradition of making every effort to attend the Divine Liturgy for all those feastdays (I also understand that the RC Church in the U.S. has basically moved the majority of the important feasts to Sundays - that is really breaking with Tradition for heaven knows what reason!).

In addition, an EC parish which is true to its heritage (as Vatican II has asked us all to be) would have a different take on the idea of primacy more in keeping with Eastern Christian collegiality and the role of the Patriarch/Primate etc. That would/should be reflected in the sermon. I would imagine, as has happened before, that Roman Catholics attending an EC Liturgy and hearing about our theology of primacy would be somewhat shocked and dismayed . . .

It is best to keep to our Particular spiritualities by attending Divine Liturgy in our respective traditions as far as possible.

Alex

Re: RC Holy Day of Obligation/Eastern Solemn Day [Re: Orthodox Catholic] #414031 12/13/15 09:01 PM
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Lester S Offline
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Originally Posted by Orthodox Catholic
Originally Posted by Paul B
Anna,

Allow me to offer this perspective. June 29 is the Feast of Sts Peter and Paul and is a day of obligation for Byzantine Catholics, but is not for Romans. Would one argue that our obligation would not be met if we attended a Roman Catholic Mass that day?

How could one be more righteous if he attended neither?


But I would say the same thing here as well. The understanding of the role of Peter in the EC Churches would be different from that in the RC Church.

The emphasis here on "obligation" is already a Latin import and non-starter to begin with. Eastern Catholics are called upon to attend the Divine Liturgy to celebrate ALL the major feasts of the Lord and of the Mother of God and the Forerunner throughout the year. And if our bishops have established "days of obligation" in imitation of the West, then EC's should just return to the original tradition of making every effort to attend the Divine Liturgy for all those feastdays (I also understand that the RC Church in the U.S. has basically moved the majority of the important feasts to Sundays - that is really breaking with Tradition for heaven knows what reason!).

In addition, an EC parish which is true to its heritage (as Vatican II has asked us all to be) would have a different take on the idea of primacy more in keeping with Eastern Christian collegiality and the role of the Patriarch/Primate etc. That would/should be reflected in the sermon. I would imagine, as has happened before, that Roman Catholics attending an EC Liturgy and hearing about our theology of primacy would be somewhat shocked and dismayed . . .

It is best to keep to our Particular spiritualities by attending Divine Liturgy in our respective traditions as far as possible.

Alex


Yes, unless one feels called to the other wink. In attempt to be immersed in the Byzantine Liturgical Life, I had to forgo my time at the respective Latin parish I had been attending. Although, this wasn't an eschewing of what I had before, but an entrance into, what was then, an unknown.

Re: RC Holy Day of Obligation/Eastern Solemn Day [Re: Lester S] #414077 12/17/15 02:11 PM
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Dear Fr. Deacon,

You have obviously had a great spiritual struggle and have experienced the Lord in a most intimate way which is the way of the Cross!

You are truly a blessing to us all!

Alex

Re: RC Holy Day of Obligation/Eastern Solemn Day [Re: Orthodox Catholic] #414080 12/17/15 05:44 PM
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Originally Posted by Orthodox Catholic

Eastern Catholics are called upon to attend the Divine Liturgy to celebrate ALL the major feasts of the Lord and of the Mother of God and the Forerunner throughout the year. And if our bishops have established "days of obligation" in imitation of the West, then EC's should just return to the original tradition of making every effort to attend the Divine Liturgy for all those feastdays (I also understand that the RC Church in the U.S. has basically moved the majority of the important feasts to Sundays - that is really breaking with Tradition for heaven knows what reason!).

I can remember in my younger years attending RC weekday Mass on holy days of obligation. It was a common practice then for parishes to offer a *very* early Mass on those days (like 6:30 or even 6:00), at which Holy Communion would be offered before the start of Mass--with the understanding that some people would have to leave before the normal Communion time.

Then, in 1973 I went to Italy, and was surprised to find that not only did they have *a lot* more holy days of obligation than we did in the United States, but also that *every* one of these was a legal holiday! Then, the following year, I got an even bigger surprise, when the Italian government decided it was time to stop having so many religious legal holidays--and the Italian bishops *immediately* reduced the number of holy days of obligation accordingly.

(Needless to say, I like the idea of "making every effort.")

Re: RC Holy Day of Obligation/Eastern Solemn Day [Re: Epiphanius] #414098 12/18/15 04:09 PM
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Yes, unfortunately I always say "make every effort" to things I believe I won't get around to doing any time soon . . . wink

Historically, of course, it was the Church that established holy-days which were "work-free" (and today "holiday" simply means a "day off").

Employers, lords of the manor et alia would have worked their subjects to the bone otherwise . . .

Alex

Last edited by Orthodox Catholic; 12/18/15 04:11 PM.

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