The Byzantine Forum
Newest Members
Melkite4Life, son of the desert, chchannel, OrbisNonSufficit, SergLts
5,657 Registered Users
Who's Online Now
1 members (1 invisible), 148 guests, and 131 robots.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Latest Photos
Byzantine Nebraska
Byzantine Nebraska
by orthodoxsinner2, December 11
Church of the Holy Trinity (UGCC) - Brazil
Church of the Holy Trinity (UGCC) - Brazil
by Santiago Tarsicio, March 17
Papal Audience 10 November 2017
Papal Audience 10 November 2017
by JLF, November 10
Upgraded Russian icon corner
Upgraded Russian icon corner
by The young fogey, October 20
Russian Greek Catholic Global Congress
Russian Greek Catholic Global Congress
by likethethief, June 12
Forum Statistics
Forums26
Topics34,879
Posts412,869
Members5,657
Most Online3,380
Dec 29th, 2019
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 33
Exegete Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 33
Looking back, it was a grave mistake for the former Eparchy of Van Nuys to move its HQ from Los Angeles (Northridge) to Phoenix.

While the chancery building was indeed severely damaged by an earthquake, and while land in the San Fernando Valley is quite expensive, the eparchy should have rebuilt or moved within Los Angeles Co./Orange Co.

Not only is SoCal the eparchy's historical home dating to the 1950s, California has more than double the parishes of any other state. It's a positive thing for the chancery to be near as many parishes as possible.

I would also suggest that Annunciation Parish in Anaheim, CA is easily the most beautiful and grand church/cathedral in the entire eparchy.

Would there be a huge amount of effort and costs involved to move the chancery back to Los Angeles or Orange County if finances ever allowed?

Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 33
Exegete Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 33
Comparing the Annunciation Parish in Anaheim, CA to the cathedral in Phoenix is stunning. It was wrong to leave CA.

Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 6,622
Moderator
Member
Offline
Moderator
Member
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 6,622
Exegete:

Christ is in our midst!!

Sometimes decisions are made by those with authority that we can not understand. Sometimes we must accept the decisions that have been made and move on.

Bob
Moderator

Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 24
B
Junior Member
Offline
Junior Member
B
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 24
I agree it was wrong to move the center of the eparchy from Van Nuys to Phoenix. There is no consideration of moving it back.

The Church in the West is not doing that well. The population in the West has been growing. Phoenix has increased population by about 50% in the last 25 years. The cathedral parish there is about the same size as it was 25 years ago. The same is true about most of our parishes there. The Church is not even attracting the people who move West from Pennsylvania and Ohio. If you took all active members of the whole eparchy it would not fill any RC Cathedral.

As the saying goes, our Ruthenian liturgical tradition is a jewel. And our bishops do a great job hiding it under politically correct Leftist gender neutral language, abbreviations and clunky chant settings.

Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 6,622
Moderator
Member
Offline
Moderator
Member
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 6,622
Hang in there. When you meet Jesus Christ, He will only ask you about how faithful you were during your pilgrimage. He won't be asking about anyone else. More and more people are leaving in all branches of the Apostolic Churches so the problem is not yours alone.

Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 5,693
B
Member
Offline
Member
B
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 5,693
Originally Posted by Blessed Theodore
I agree it was wrong to move the center of the eparchy from Van Nuys to Phoenix. There is no consideration of moving it back.

The Church in the West is not doing that well. The population in the West has been growing. Phoenix has increased population by about 50% in the last 25 years. The cathedral parish there is about the same size as it was 25 years ago. The same is true about most of our parishes there. The Church is not even attracting the people who move West from Pennsylvania and Ohio. If you took all active members of the whole eparchy it would not fill any RC Cathedral.

As the saying goes, our Ruthenian liturgical tradition is a jewel. And our bishops do a great job hiding it under politically correct Leftist gender neutral language, abbreviations and clunky chant settings.


Unfortunately, this forum doesn't allow me to click a 'thanks' or 'I agree' button, but you have nailed it quite accurately, I think.

Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 33
Exegete Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 33
Originally Posted by theophan
Exegete:

Christ is in our midst!!

Sometimes decisions are made by those with authority that we can not understand. Sometimes we must accept the decisions that have been made and move on.

Bob
Moderator


I remember talking to Father Stephen Washko about this matter back when Father Stephen was still posted in AZ. The Northridge Earthquake did grave damage to the eparchy's chancery building -- and to a fairly large chunk of the San Fernando Valley. The earthquake spooked a great many people.

The easy thing to do was to sell the valuable Northridge property for $$$ and bug out to AZ. In retrospect, it seems to have been done in haste. What I do know is that move has had a most deleterious effect on the eparchy.

Aside from the costs of procuring a new chancery building and housing the clerical staff, are there other huge obstacles and costs associated with returning the eparchy to its home in Los Angeles County?

It doesn't seem if any of the resources that have been created in AZ would go unused?

Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 33
Exegete Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 33
Originally Posted by Blessed Theodore
I agree it was wrong to move the center of the eparchy from Van Nuys to Phoenix. There is no consideration of moving it back.

The Church in the West is not doing that well. The population in the West has been growing. Phoenix has increased population by about 50% in the last 25 years. The cathedral parish there is about the same size as it was 25 years ago. The same is true about most of our parishes there. The Church is not even attracting the people who move West from Pennsylvania and Ohio. If you took all active members of the whole eparchy it would not fill any RC Cathedral.

As the saying goes, our Ruthenian liturgical tradition is a jewel. And our bishops do a great job hiding it under politically correct Leftist gender neutral language, abbreviations and clunky chant settings.


Thank you for your thoughtful comments. I fully agree our Ruthenian liturgical tradition is a jewel. I don't agree with the reasons you gave for the Ruthenian Church's lack of growth -- at least as it pertains to my Ruthenian parish. I think there are a number of reasons why small Ruthenian parishes don't grow. Let me name a few at least with regard to my Ruthenian parish:

1. I don't think most Ruthenian pastors are educated and trained on how to evangelize. Many have no idea where to begin. It's not an easy thing.

2. Many Ruthenian pastors and members of the laity (mostly disgruntled RCs) fear a loss of control should their parishes actually begin to thrive.

3. Many Ruthenian pastors and members of the laity (mostly disgruntled RCs) fear a dilution of Ruthenian spiritual and liturgical practices -- so-called "Latinizations."

4. Many parishes risk losing their small but solid financial base if they reach out and evangelize. In my parish all it would take is adding a dozen new tithing families/individuals to end this risk.

My parish has a terrific new pastor. It's located in a part of the world where it could easily grow by 2X-3X. It has a physical plant that could support that. What remains to be seen if it has the expertise and commitment to actually make it happen.

It's going to have to be realistic though. If the parish actually begins to grow, rather than immediately push to fund an expensive church building expansion, maybe it needs to (GASP!) offer a Saturday evening DL, and/or a second DL on Sundays based upon when people would be most apt to attend.

Rather than pave-over its front lawn to provide more parking, maybe it needs to gleefully rely on ample street parking where people might have to walk half a block to the church's entrance.

Maybe it needs to embrace beloved local traditions (e.g. Santa Maria Style BBQ) for at least some of its celebrations.

In any event, there's a great deal that could be done -- at least for those parishes located in communities with ample populations and not shuttered former steel mill villages.


Link Copied to Clipboard
The Byzantine Forum provides message boards for discussions focusing on Eastern Christianity (though discussions of other topics are welcome). The views expressed herein are those of the participants and may or may not reflect the teachings of the Byzantine Catholic or any other Church. The Byzantine Forum and the www.byzcath.org site exist to help build up the Church but are unofficial, have no connection with any Church entity, and should not be looked to as a source for official information for any Church. All posts become property of byzcath.org. Contents copyright - 1996-2020 (Forum 1998-2020). All rights reserved.
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.5