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Latin to Eastern Rite Canonical Switch #420139 08/10/20 12:00 AM
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John Joseph Offline OP
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Hello, i'm currently in the process of canonically changing to the Byzantine Rite (UGCC specifically). I was wondering if the UGCC in America was ordaining married men? The call to priesthood is a completely separate call then being called to the East, for me at least. I feel called to be an Eastern Catholic because of the spirituality and Divine Liturgy, not so I can "sneak one past Rome" and "be a priest", so to speak.

However, a couple things about the call to priesthood (sorry for the long story-like questions):

1) I hear a lot of online Catholic communities (mainly Eastern) not look favorably towards Latin Catholic men switching to the East and having the call to the priesthood on his heart. They seem to think that the man is, as I said before, trying to "sneak one past Rome" and have his cake and eat it too, also so to speak. I personally feel that this attitude, while mysteriously protective, can kill proper vocations by discouraging those with right intent, such as myself, from even pursuing the separate issue of being called to the priesthood. What are your thoughts on this matter everyone?

2) My Spiritual Father doesn't seem to think it's an issue to have two callings. He says it's not impossible, but it can be very difficult in my case. I seem to think he was alluding to Question One's situation above. I also seem to think that there needs to be proper teaching among my people (UGCC) about the dual call to East and Holy Orders.

Remember, not everyone has sneaky intent. There are good men out there with good intentions. For example, if I was to enter into the UGCC as an Eastern Catholic from the Latin Church and could never get into a single seminary for the rest of my days, I would be even more joyous that God chose me to not have the heavy burden of Holy Orders. That being said, something is calling me into ministry.

Pray for me and my vocation!
Glory to Jesus Christ!

Re: Latin to Eastern Rite Canonical Switch [Re: John Joseph] #420140 08/10/20 02:10 PM
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Originally Posted by John Joseph
Hello, i'm currently in the process of canonically changing to the Byzantine Rite (UGCC specifically). I was wondering if the UGCC in America was ordaining married men? The call to priesthood is a completely separate call then being called to the East, for me at least. I feel called to be an Eastern Catholic because of the spirituality and Divine Liturgy, not so I can "sneak one past Rome" and "be a priest", so to speak.

However, a couple things about the call to priesthood (sorry for the long story-like questions):

1) I hear a lot of online Catholic communities (mainly Eastern) not look favorably towards Latin Catholic men switching to the East and having the call to the priesthood on his heart. They seem to think that the man is, as I said before, trying to "sneak one past Rome" and have his cake and eat it too, also so to speak. I personally feel that this attitude, while mysteriously protective, can kill proper vocations by discouraging those with right intent, such as myself, from even pursuing the separate issue of being called to the priesthood. What are your thoughts on this matter everyone?

2) My Spiritual Father doesn't seem to think it's an issue to have two callings. He says it's not impossible, but it can be very difficult in my case. I seem to think he was alluding to Question One's situation above. I also seem to think that there needs to be proper teaching among my people (UGCC) about the dual call to East and Holy Orders.

Remember, not everyone has sneaky intent. There are good men out there with good intentions. For example, if I was to enter into the UGCC as an Eastern Catholic from the Latin Church and could never get into a single seminary for the rest of my days, I would be even more joyous that God chose me to not have the heavy burden of Holy Orders. That being said, something is calling me into ministry.

Pray for me and my vocation!
Glory to Jesus Christ!


Honestly, why you want to go Byzantine is beyond me. Perhaps because you are in love with the Liturgy of St. John Chrysostom, as I was as a Protestant convert, and are not filled in on the history of Byzantine Catholicism in America. If you look at the history of the Ruthenians and the UGCC, they knuckled under when Rome bullied them in the United States. They have totally lost their identity as "ORTHODOX in Communion with Rome" and became "Rome Lite". The most recent act of obsequiousness from the Ruthenians , which sent at least a dozen of my friends out the door and over to Orthodoxy, was their publication of the "Teal Terror," the new pew book which had the nerve to change the wording of the Creed and incorporate "gender neutral" language in the prayers. It wouldn't surprise me if the UGCC was far behind. I speak as an X member of both of them.

I was inline to become a deacon in the Ruthenian rite but got thrown out of the seminary when I made a stink about the new priest assigned to our parish. He was completely violating at least 10 points in the Liturgicon, yet no one said a thing about him, neither did they defend me. I am not the only one who didn't finish the class. I can't say my treatment in the UGCC was much better. My attempts to enter the diaconate there were met with a yawn

Honestly, either look to the Melkites or go Orthodox. Don't play with half measures. You can't be both at the same time. The experiment with Uniattism is an utter failure in my opinion. (I know I am going to get yards of flack over this - so be it).

I am on my way to Orthodoxy unless the Lord stops me. You cannot mix oil and water, and that is what Uniatism is. If truth in doctrine is important, then go to the Orthodox. If not, then I guess it doesn't matter, does it?

I pray you find your vocation and do so with people who will love and respect you instead of boil you in oil.

Re: Latin to Eastern Rite Canonical Switch [Re: Irish_Ruthenian] #420141 08/10/20 04:48 PM
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John Joseph Offline OP
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I appreciate this honest answer, but it sounds like there is a lot of "sour grapes" within here.

I've done my research into the history of Eastern Catholicism in America and found nothing that has deterred me. In fact, it has spurred me on into my calling into the East. The point of history is to not repeat it, in which we should strive to learn from our mistakes. I see that Rome is handling these Latinizations with more grace and class then they did before. I see nothing but positive results going on. There may even be a reunion of Catholicism and Orthodoxy within our lifetimes.

Keep on praying for unity!

Re: Latin to Eastern Rite Canonical Switch [Re: John Joseph] #420142 08/10/20 06:20 PM
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theophan Offline
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Christ is in our midst!!

John Joseph:

Welcome to the forum!! I pray that your time with us will be spiritually fruitful.

That said, your pilgrimage is your pilgrimage. Do not let negativity from an one or more individuals deter you journey of discernment. Be sure that you include a solid priest in your study and processes. What I mean is to find a priest who takes your spiritual journey seriously. Internet fora are not the place to find the answers to your questions, so take advice you receive in them with a grain of salt.

Prayers for you in your journey.

Bob
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Re: Latin to Eastern Rite Canonical Switch [Re: John Joseph] #420144 08/10/20 07:07 PM
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Originally Posted by John Joseph
I appreciate this honest answer, but it sounds like there is a lot of "sour grapes" within here.

I've done my research into the history of Eastern Catholicism in America and found nothing that has deterred me. In fact, it has spurred me on into my calling into the East. The point of history is to not repeat it, in which we should strive to learn from our mistakes. I see that Rome is handling these Latinizations with more grace and class then they did before. I see nothing but positive results going on. There may even be a reunion of Catholicism and Orthodoxy within our lifetimes.

Keep on praying for unity!


Believe me, if there were "sour grapes" in my post, it would have been a mile long with names and flaming accusations. I was just posting my experience with the Byzantines, which has been very negative to this point. Oh, I did meet some wonderful individuals and individual priests, but the organization itself.............meaaaaah.

I also encourage you to discern where you belong and agree with Bob that you find a priest who takes your spiritual journey seriously. The best thing that ever happened to me was to find a kind, caring, and wise spiritual director 2 years ago. I hope the same for you.

As for unity.....until Rome disavows all Her theological inventions and returns to the faith of the first 800 years of the united Church, it probably will not happen. We should pray for it, but as Fr. Thomas Hopko wrote in a paper many years ago, Rome will have to give up some of their cherished ideas which the Fathers of the Church never taught and most likely would have not agreed to.

I wish you the best of God's blessings.

Re: Latin to Eastern Rite Canonical Switch [Re: John Joseph] #420468 10/09/20 01:45 PM
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my feeling is this. I don't think that any and every man who turns East all of a sudden conveniently gets a call to the Priesthood is trying to pull a fasty on Rome. if the calling is sincere, great. give people the benefit of a doubt and let God b the ultimate judge here


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