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#276251 - 01/31/08 10:46 AM
Re: The term "Orthodox"
[Re: Orthodox Catholic]
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Serge Keleher
Member
Registered: 06/22/06
Posts: 2937
Loc: Dublin
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In either Church-Slavonic or Russian, one may also say Kaftolicheskyi.
I suppose the difference lies in the distinction between a certain ecclesiology and a certain ecclesial structure!
Fr. Serge
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#276304 - 01/31/08 05:04 PM
Re: The term "Orthodox"
[Re: Orthodox Catholic]
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Highlander
learner
Member
Registered: 05/26/06
Posts: 147
Loc: North of Scotland
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Dear Alex,
I don’t know if this is the kind of comment you meant, but here is what I think has happened. In “KaFOlik”, which is taken directly from Greek, the theta in katholikos has become a Ф (as in Фёдор from Θεοδορος).
However, “KaTOlik” has probably been borrowed from Latin/Italian , where catholicus > cattolico.
So the two forms neatly separate the two meanings “universal” and “in communion with the See of Peter”. This sort of thing happens a lot in languages. It’s something like the way regal/royal in English is the same word twice, and something like the way flower/flour is division into two of a single word.
Regards.
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#276374 - 02/01/08 05:17 AM
Re: The term "Orthodox"
[Re: Highlander]
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Serge Keleher
Member
Registered: 06/22/06
Posts: 2937
Loc: Dublin
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Actually, I strongly suspect that "Katolik" is a calque from Polish.
Fr. Serge
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#276459 - 02/01/08 02:29 PM
Re: The term "Orthodox"
[Re: Serge Keleher]
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domilsean
Orthodox domilsean
Member
Registered: 12/22/04
Posts: 522
Loc: Pittsburgh
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Well, all I know is that to my public school friends in the PA coal region, this Polack went to "da katlick school". Maybe it's a calque of the Irish-English Coal Region dialect... 
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#276501 - 02/01/08 06:58 PM
Re: The term "Orthodox"
[Re: domilsean]
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Serge Keleher
Member
Registered: 06/22/06
Posts: 2937
Loc: Dublin
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In some districts of the USA there were two sorts of people: "publics" and "Catholics". This referred, of course, to the schools which each attended.
Fr. Serge
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#276504 - 02/01/08 07:14 PM
Re: The term "Orthodox"
[Re: Serge Keleher]
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Administrator
Administrator
Member
Registered: 11/02/01
Posts: 4505
Loc: Virginia
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This topic seems to have wandered from "Orthodox" to "Catholic". Hmmmm... if it starts moving towards "Protestant" or "Nondenominational" or some such direction we may have to close it! 
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#281890 - 03/08/08 03:04 AM
Re: The term "Orthodox"
[Re: Administrator]
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Mykhayl
Member
Registered: 02/16/08
Posts: 272
Loc: Pgh, PA USA
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C. I. X.
Admittedly language is not my strong suite so I am asking for a clarification. If we are talking transition of terms, orthodox from the Greek is true belief. But from the Slavonic does it not come out as true glory? Is that as in proper worship being we believe what we pray? So is not “catholic” a reference to the church while “orthodox” describes the faith? Then there is one, holy, catholic and apostolic church of the orthodox faith?
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#281948 - 03/08/08 12:20 PM
Re: The term "Orthodox"
[Re: Administrator]
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Serge Keleher
Member
Registered: 06/22/06
Posts: 2937
Loc: Dublin
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At least in the circles most of the Forum travel in, neither "Protestant" nor "Non-Denominational" are so emotionally charged as to provoke the same sort of anger that "Orthodox", "orthodox", and "Catholic" are apt to provoke. [There is also the word "catholic", which has no particular religious significance - if I should say that a gourmet friend has catholic taste in restaurants, I am not discussing his religious outlook, if any.]
This is not to say that on their own "home ground", so to speak, "Protestant" or "Non-Denominational" cannot provoke an argument - it's just to say that this Forum is not that home ground so we are not apt to get into a controversy over either of these terms.
Fr. Serge (who protests against many things, but is nevertheless not a Protestant, and supports catholic taste in foods, with the exception of those which he does not enjoy).
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#288438 - 05/10/08 12:12 AM
Re: The term "Orthodox"
[Re: Serge Keleher]
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ThePilgrim
Junior Member
Registered: 03/28/07
Posts: 1
Loc: Pittsburgh, PA
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Personally, I've always seen соборный to mean catholic in Slavonic, in the sense that it's used in the Creed, where as Roman Catholics are referred to as католики.
FWIW.
John
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#288719 - 05/13/08 06:54 PM
Re: The term "Orthodox"
[Re: Byzantine TX]
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Stephanie Kotyuh
Member
Registered: 09/22/06
Posts: 151
Loc: Medina, OH
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Don't say the "o" word too loud, you might get a nasty-gram from the Bishop. One priest in the Eparchy of Parma received a letter telling him to stop using the word "orthodox" and use the phrase "true faith."
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