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#278411 - 02/13/08 03:56 PM
Re: My version of Pascal’s Wager: Catholicism or Orthodoxy?
[Re: Stephanos I]
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ajk
Deacon
Member
Registered: 05/22/07
Posts: 369
Loc: MD
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(Now I am not saying that the Orthodox are not the Church) they most certainly are apart of the one holy catholic and apostolic faith.
I presume it is that "they most certainly are" a part...
PS Perhaps that can be a discussion of another thread, "What actually consitutes the Church" A Discussion of Ecclesiology.
Excellent topic.
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#278418 - 02/13/08 04:59 PM
Re: My version of Pascal’s Wager: Catholicism or Orthodoxy?
[Re: Pilgrim Dave]
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harmon3110
Grateful
Member
Registered: 08/03/04
Posts: 3075
Loc: Ohio, USA
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This is my version of Pascal’s Wager: Catholicism or Orthodoxy? [ . . . ] So while my heart is in the East, my head is unsure between Catholicism and Orthodoxy.
Dave,
I used to be Catholic, and now I am Orthodox. You wrote that your heart is in the East but your head is unsure. Wow, I can relate to that, from one point in my discernment. Here is my comment, from what I have learned.
Your heart will never be satisfied by either Church. Neither is perfect; each has its share of sins as well as good points, and only God gives lasting, permanent peace. And dare I say it: God is a whole lot bigger than any human mind or religion or denomination.
Your heart will only be satisfied by God. How you find your way to Him is excatly that. If the Catholic Church gets you closer to God, ok. If the Eastern Church (EO, EC, or OO) gets you closer to God, ok. If the Evengelical or Charismatic churches gets you closer to God, ok.
Please don't try to calculate the odds of being in "the fullness of the faith." Be in the place where you are at peace with God in Christ through the Holy Spirit, and there is the fullness of the faith for you.
In closing, I encourage you to continue to ask God; and He will guide you. Part of that might include visiting several different parishes of different churches over time; and taking your good, sweet time in making your decision.
God bless you, and good luck.
-- John
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#278428 - 02/13/08 06:00 PM
Re: My version of Pascal’s Wager: Catholicism or Orthodoxy?
[Re: harmon3110]
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Stephanos I
Member
Registered: 02/03/02
Posts: 1860
Loc: West Coast
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John.
I dont want to pick on you, it's great that you found Orthodoxy, but you do seem to me, at least from reading your message, have a somewhat distorted Ecclesiology.
Christ cannot be seperated from HIS Church, neither can the Church be sinful. (Individuals can be sinful, but it is not the Church.) The Church is the bride of Christ, Pure, Holy, Innocent, without spot or wrinkle. It has been washed in the blood of the Lamb.
And as for being in the place where you are at peace with God, maybe we are the ones to move and not God. What some term peace is just an unawakened conscience.
Let the Holy Spirit move you out of your comfort zone.
I seem to remember a scripture; "Woe to the complacent in Zion."
Stephanos I
And please do not take this as an attack on you, it was just said to make us think.
Edited by Stephanos I (02/13/08 06:02 PM)
Edit Reason: mispellled words
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#278437 - 02/13/08 07:24 PM
Re: My version of Pascal’s Wager: Catholicism or Orthodoxy?
[Re: peso73]
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peso73
Junior Member
Registered: 01/26/08
Posts: 29
Loc: Los Angeles, CA
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by the way I love Orthodox to and I have no doubt any true believing Orthodox will be with any true believing Catholic, either eastern or western rites, along with a bunch of true believing non-catholic, non-orthodox christians, along with a lot of good people who for whatever reason could not accept our Lord while here on earth.....I think, and I may be straying into heretical thought process' here, but some people like an old friend of my sister, who was raised by WICCAN PARENTS! Then some knucklehead t-boned her on the way to school and killed her. My mom thinks she's in hell, I believe, but I don't necessarily... HELLO! Why would she accept Christ? Her mom and dad were witches! I am pretty sure they taught her all Chistianity was nonsense so we'll see. I guess we have to see with the light we are given, and mine seems to illuminate icons and the Vatican at the same time, so eastern rite Catholic Church seems wonderful.
Edited by Alice (02/14/08 08:03 AM)
Edit Reason: inappropriate adjective-reported as offensive
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#278472 - 02/14/08 07:10 AM
Re: My version of Pascal’s Wager: Catholicism or Orthodoxy?
[Re: Stephanos I]
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harmon3110
Grateful
Member
Registered: 08/03/04
Posts: 3075
Loc: Ohio, USA
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John.
I dont want to pick on you, it's great that you found Orthodoxy, but you do seem to me, at least from reading your message, have a somewhat distorted Ecclesiology.
Christ cannot be seperated from HIS Church, neither can the Church be sinful. (Individuals can be sinful, but it is not the Church.) The Church is the bride of Christ, Pure, Holy, Innocent, without spot or wrinkle. It has been washed in the blood of the Lamb.
And as for being in the place where you are at peace with God, maybe we are the ones to move and not God. What some term peace is just an unawakened conscience.
Let the Holy Spirit move you out of your comfort zone.
I seem to remember a scripture; "Woe to the complacent in Zion."
Stephanos I
And please do not take this as an attack on you, it was just said to make us think.
Fr. Stephanos,
I'm not offended at all, but I am startled. I didn't mean to imply that Christ is separated from His Church. Instead, I tried to express that the original poster shouldn't be discerning the church he should join by hedging his bets. Instead, he should focus on where God wants him.
-- John
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#278533 - 02/14/08 02:10 PM
Re: My version of Pascal’s Wager: Catholicism or Orthodoxy?
[Re: harmon3110]
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Elizabeth Maria
Member
Registered: 12/20/03
Posts: 753
Loc: West Coast
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John,
God wants all of us to be united with Him in His One Holy Catholic and Apostolic Church.
Unfortunately the devil like a roaring lion roams through the world seeking those whom he may devour through schism, heresy, and hatred, which spring from pride.
In Christ,
Elizabeth Maria
Dave,
I used to be Catholic, and now I am Orthodox. You wrote that your heart is in the East but your head is unsure. Wow, I can relate to that, from one point in my discernment. Here is my comment, from what I have learned.
Your heart will never be satisfied by either Church. Neither is perfect; each has its share of sins as well as good points, and only God gives lasting, permanent peace. And dare I say it: God is a whole lot bigger than any human mind or religion or denomination.
Your heart will only be satisfied by God. How you find your way to Him is exactly that. If the Catholic Church gets you closer to God, ok. If the Eastern Church (EO, EC, or OO) gets you closer to God, ok. If the Evangelical or Charismatic churches gets you closer to God, ok.
Please don't try to calculate the odds of being in "the fullness of the faith." Be in the place where you are at peace with God in Christ through the Holy Spirit, and there is the fullness of the faith for you.
In closing, I encourage you to continue to ask God; and He will guide you. Part of that might include visiting several different parishes of different churches over time; and taking your good, sweet time in making your decision.
God bless you, and good luck.
-- John
minor spelling corrections made in the above
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