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Old Believer groups #291391
06/11/08 11:45 AM
06/11/08 11:45 AM
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old orthodox Offline OP
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http://www.egorievsk.ru/eng/history/old_believers_of_gouslitsy.html

This website mentions several old rite groups I am not familiar with, does anyone know who the Neokrouzhniki,Louzhkane,Makeevtsy,groups are?

old orthodox

Re: Old Believer groups [Re: old orthodox] #291483
06/12/08 02:41 AM
06/12/08 02:41 AM
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Irish Melkite Offline
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Originally Posted by old orthodox
http://www.egorievsk.ru/eng/history/old_believers_of_gouslitsy.html

This website mentions several old rite groups I am not familiar with, does anyone know who the Neokrouzhniki, Louzhkane, Makeevtsy, groups are?


Old Orthodox,

In 1863, a bishop of the Beilokrinitskaya Hierarchy issued an encyclical or circular letter that expressed oneness with the established Church in supporting the Tsar and government’s response to an insurrection in Polish lands under Russian control. There were diverse reactions to it among the Beilokrinitskaya and it effectively broke the unity of that body, splitting it among Neokruzhniki, Okruzhniki, and Raznordiki.

The Neokruzhniki (Non-Encyclicalists or Non-Circularists) perceived the 1863 encyclical as counter to everything for which Old Believers stood, in that it supported a Tsar and government that represented, or perhaps were, the Anti-Christ and his minions. After separating from the Beilokrinitskaya Ierarkhiya, the Neokruzhniki succeeded in maintaining a distinct identity for about a half-century, but lack of a consistent source from which to replenish clergy losses took a toll on its numbers.

Some were absorbed into the Edinovertsi (the United Believers - those who accepted a usage established by the Orthodox Church to allow Old Believer praxis within the structure of the Orthodox Church). The remainder became priestless, worshipping in house churches under lay leadership. Neokrushniki are extinct as a discernable, separate, ecclesial body; however, a few small bodies are said to survive from the separatist movement and reportedly resist being categorized as Bespopovtsy, despite being priestless.

Both the Louzhkane and Makeevtsy derive from the Beglopopovtsi (Runaway Priests), a movement that hovered between those of the Popovtsy and Bespopovtsy. Lacking a hierarchy and without adequate numbers of presbyters, they looked for clergy to those willing to train in Russian Orthodox seminaries and then defect after ordination.

Reliance on such an inconsistent and unpredictable source of clerics, though, meant that Beglopopovtsi faithful found themselves in environments that continually shifted from being priested to priestless and back again. Ultimately, influenced both by the availability or non-availability of priests and, occasionally, by changes in theological mindset regarding the need for such, the Beglopopovtsi congregations became fixed in one or the other status and Beglopopovtsi ceased to exist as a separately identifiable ecclesial group.

As to particulars of the two sub-groups named:

Luzhkovskoe Soglasie (Luzhkov‘s Compact), also termed Luzhkovtsy, Luzhkane, and Louzhkane, was a priested body centered in Pavlovsky Posad. After a sustained period of being priestless in the mid-19th century, a status which they apparently found disheartening, most Luzhkovtsy were received into mainstream Russian Orthodoxy (rather than being received under the Edinovertsi aegis). They took this step under the leadership of two kinsmen - Yakob Labzin and Vasily Gryiznov. Those of them who resisted returning to their historic spiritual roots did not affiliate with any other Popovtsy or Bespopovtsy and their numbers continued to decline. Reportedly, remnant individuals, but no extant communities, survive.

(A few years ago, Gryiznov was canonized by the Russian Orthodox Church and his cultus was approved for local veneration. The missionary work which he performed among the Staroviertsi, subsequent to his own entry into communion, apparently precipitated his canonization.)

Makeevtsy (Makeev‘s Confession) was another body continuously torn between a priested and priestless existence. As with the Luzhkane, Makeevtsy chose or failed, for whatever reason, to ally themselves to any of the larger and more stable Popovtsy or Bespopovtsy congregations and suffered the same fate. Reports indicate no organized, functioning communities are extant but, again, only scattered remnant faithful. I haven't been able to learn any specifics as to what praxis or theology specifically differentiated them from the Luzhkane and it's possible that none did - that they were merely followers of different leaders who gave their names to the respective bodies - that was not uncommon.

Many years,

Neil


"One day all our ethnic traits ... will have disappeared. Time itself is seeing to this. And so we can not think of our communities as ethnic parishes, ... unless we wish to assure the death of our community."
Re: Old Believer groups [Re: Irish Melkite] #291496
06/12/08 11:09 AM
06/12/08 11:09 AM
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Thank You very much Irish Melkite for explaining everything with such clarity and depth.

Many Years

old orthodox

Re: Old Believer groups [Re: old orthodox] #291499
06/12/08 12:59 PM
06/12/08 12:59 PM
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Originally Posted by old orthodox
Thank You very much Irish Melkite for explaining everything with such clarity and depth.

Many Years

old orthodox


Does anyone know anything about the so-called "Clementite" Popovtsy?

Re: Old Believer groups [Re: asianpilgrim] #291582
06/13/08 04:31 AM
06/13/08 04:31 AM
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Originally Posted by asianpilgrim
Does anyone know anything about the so-called "Clementite" Popovtsy?


Pilgrim,

The Edinovertsi (United Believers), also "Co-Religionists" or "Church Old Believers", whom I referenced above were Old Believers, principally drawn from among the Popovtsy, who accepted a "usage" (for lack of a better term) established by the Orthodox Church. It allowed Old Believer praxis to be observed within the structure of the Orthodox Church.

The plan was predicated on a perception that differences in praxis were the sole, or at least major, factor motivating Old Believers. It was successful insofar as the usage exists to this day, but failed to achieve such numbers in its early decades to make a convincing argument that praxis was the overriding consideration. In its inception, it was compared to the Uniate movement within the Catholic Church and the term "Uniate" has been applied to both it and its faithful.

Although there is no history of formal schism within the Edinovertsi, some lines of Old Believer hierarchs appear to have been possibly uncertain of their future under the omophor of Orthodox hierarchs from whom they had been so long estranged. These, together with their faithful, maintained a distant and semi-independent existence within the larger Church at varying times and for somewhat vaguely defined periods.

These were apparently relatively short-lived phenomena, as they merit, at most, foot-note reference in most texts on Old Believers. Among them were the Andreevtsy (Andrew’s Hierarchy) and Klimentovtsy (Kliment's or Clement’s Hierarchy).

The latter - Klimentovskaya Ierarkhiya - were so-called from their proto-hierarch, a Bishop Kliment, of blessed memory. The Clementites were Katakombnyi or "Catacombists", for obvious reasons, under Russian Communist rule. Bishop Kliment was reportedly ordained to the episcopate in the 1920s by Bishop Andrew of Ufa, also of blessed memory.

Bishop Andrew is better known than Kliment, since the Andreevtsy, to whom he gave his name, are more commonly known as the "Andrewites" - categorized (depending on one's viewpoint) either as Old Calendrists who resisted the MP on grounds of its Communist ties or as Old Believers. My perception is that they began as the latter and morphed into the former.

You can likely find some mention of them in writings/sites related to ROCOR in its various early manifestations. Most references will be ambivalent at best, because there seems to be no consensus on Bishop Andrew's canonicity (thus, calling into question that of Kliment as well). What is clear is that Andrew was martyred in the late 1930s. The Andrewites themselves were sans episcopi by the late 1980s and there was significant controversy over the means by which they subsequently acquired/consecrated replacement hierarchs. The body still exists, I think, as a microcosmic entity - but I don't think it is accorded canonicity by either Old Calendrists or Old Believers. I suspect that whatever remained of the Clementites were absorbed into it at some point in time, subsequent to Kliment's repose.

Many years,

Neil


"One day all our ethnic traits ... will have disappeared. Time itself is seeing to this. And so we can not think of our communities as ethnic parishes, ... unless we wish to assure the death of our community."

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