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#385116 - 08/23/12 08:58 PM
Re: WRO if Catholics/Orthodox unite?
[Re: IAlmisry]
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Registered: 07/10/05
Posts: 2093
Loc: Chicago
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Up to but not including. No communion has been ever been broken even by the harshest "Orthodox" critics of WRO.
The first WRO DL was in 1870 for those in what is now in jurisdiction of the Church of the Czech Lands and Slovakia. The original impetus came from contacts with those who refused to go along with Vatican I and mostly ended up as "Old Catholics."
This website says 1911. The 1890 Czech WR were acknowledged and supported by some Eastern Orthodox, but never in Communion. The first WRO were under the Bishops of the Syriac-Indian Orthodox Church, around 1892. These were never in Communion with any Eastern Orthodox jurisdiction either.
LOL. Yeah, that's what it is. Only thing separating them from "the Holy See" is their past hatred of the pope. In the Vatican, that is. They all love the original Pope, in Alexandria.
H.H. Pope Shenouda of blessed memory is loved by most everyone, especially by those of the British Orthodox Church in full Communion with the late Pontiff.
Edited by Michael_Thoma (08/23/12 08:59 PM)
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#385124 - 08/23/12 10:50 PM
Re: WRO if Catholics/Orthodox unite?
[Re: Peter J]
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Member
Registered: 01/06/08
Posts: 746
Loc: Chicago
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I think the way the Byzantine Catholics have handled communion and unity with the Holy See is probably the best model - practice AND PRESERVE your traditions in communion with the Holy See.
I think Pope John Paul II would agree with you -- see, for example "We give thanks to God for the Union of Brest"(!) We're not supposed to bring that up. Ah. I'll try to remember that, though it may be difficult considering what a large chuck of my life was during JPII's pontificate. Right now, isn't that true of most people?
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#385126 - 08/23/12 11:21 PM
Re: WRO if Catholics/Orthodox unite?
[Re: Michael_Thoma]
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Member
Registered: 01/06/08
Posts: 746
Loc: Chicago
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Up to but not including. No communion has been ever been broken even by the harshest "Orthodox" critics of WRO.
The first WRO DL was in 1870 for those in what is now in jurisdiction of the Church of the Czech Lands and Slovakia. The original impetus came from contacts with those who refused to go along with Vatican I and mostly ended up as "Old Catholics."
This website says 1911. The 1890 Czech WR were acknowledged and supported by some Eastern Orthodox, but never in Communion. Yes, they were. The Reports of the Ober-Procurator of the Holy Governing Synod reports on the Prague Church from the early 1870's onward. The HGS approved the Tridentine Liturgy and Benedictine Offices in September 1869. They were organized into a diocese in 1898. Until the 1930's, most Orthodox in Czechoslovakia were WRO. They were overwhelmed by the Return to Orthodoxy in Carpato-Russia. Btw, the WRO, in a way, started in the same region: the Utraquists petitioned for it to Constantinople in 1452, their emissary actually embracing Orthodoxy, and thereafter seeking priests and a union with the the Metropolitan of Kiev and All Rus' at Moscow. St. Gorazd finally brought the Brethren home in the Patriarchate of Serbia, which then had jurisdiction.
The first WRO were under the Bishops of the Syriac-Indian Orthodox Church, around 1892. These were never in Communion with any Eastern Orthodox jurisdiction either.
They had been received into the jurisdiction of Bishop Vladimir of Alaska and the Aleutians, but jumped for the Syriac Indian Church before being received into the Church. Their "bishop" Vilatte had a long careers getting all the pseudo-episcopal lines going.
LOL. Yeah, that's what it is. Only thing separating them from "the Holy See" is their past hatred of the pope. In the Vatican, that is. They all love the original Pope, in Alexandria.
H.H. Pope Shenouda of blessed memory is loved by most everyone, especially by those of the British Orthodox Church in full Communion with the late Pontiff. yes,him too. I had the privilege and pleasure of meeting His Holiness and having him sign my Khulagi. They, said evangelical converts to Orthodoxy, love him too.
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#385239 - 08/26/12 12:05 AM
Re: WRO if Catholics/Orthodox unite?
[Re: haydukovich]
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Member
Registered: 01/06/08
Posts: 746
Loc: Chicago
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This is in Wikipedia ... let me know if this is wrong
During the 1840s, the Reverend William Palmer corresponded with Metropolitan (Saint) Philaret of Moscow, and Alexei Stephanovich Khomiakov. The initial reason for the correspondence was to consider establishing a Western Orthodox Church in England. The project was not carried out due to lack of funds.
The modern reemergence of an Orthodox Western Rite bore its first fruits in 1864 with the work of former Catholic priest Julius Joseph Overbeck. Overbeck had left the priesthood, converted to Lutheranism and married, though it is uncertain whether he ever functioned as a Lutheran pastor. He immigrated to England in 1863 to become professor of German at the Royal Military Academy. There he studied the Church of England and Orthodoxy. Concluding that both the Papacy and Anglicanism were on the verge of collapse, Overbeck was received into the Orthodox Church at the Russian Embassy in London by Father Eugene Poppoff, the embassy chaplain, in 1865. Overbeck was received as a layman because he had married following his ordination.[3] basically correct, but I'm not sure what import that has.
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