What happened in Russia was similar to what happened in France during the Revolution except that virtually all Eastern Catholic leaders were murdered or arrested. The one way of escape would have been to convert to Russian Orthodoxy. It is a good that those horrific days are mostly over. I keep wondering if there are instances in which Orthodox people hid and protected Eastern Catholics from this persecution.

http://www.ask.com/wiki/Eastern_Catholic_victims_of_Soviet_persecutions

For the vast majority of Greek Catholics, nothing changed except the name on the door of the church. An heroic minority went underground, but most accepted the change in management because there was no change in liturgy, theology or spirituality: the Tradition was maintained. This is what caused so much internal friction in the Greek Catholic Churches after the fall of communism: those who went into the catacombs saw themselves (and probably still do) as the "true Church", those who accepted the forced reunions as "apostates", or at best, spiritually weak.

It also explains the shock expressed by both Moscow and Rome when a very large portion of the Orthodox clergy and faithful in Ukraine happily announced their adherence to the Greek Catholic Church as soon as it was safe to do so: they had never considered themselves "Orthodox", but as Greek Catholics presently worshiping in churches claimed by the Orthodox. Moscow can be blamed for drinking its own bathwater, but Rome also shares the blame because it wanted so badly to believe Moscow assertion that there had been a "final solution" to the Uniate Problem. The Curia should have believed Patriarchs Josef and Miroslav Ivan when they said the Greek Catholics were still a force in Ukraine.

Dan,

I am going to say - for the last time - that this topic serves no valid purpose of discussion, dialogue, or education.

There is no basis for disagreement with the fact that there were those among the Orthodox who collaborated with the Russian Communist regime. Likewise, there is no basis to believe that there were not those among the Catholic populace who did so as well. Perhaps this is as good a place and time as any to point out that neither baptism, chrismation, nor calling oneself Catholic or Orthodox makes one a faithful and observant member of whichever Church and one can certainly doubt, nay even deny, that those who elected to do so are entitled to be held up as true members of their Churches.

While focusing on Russia affords an easy opportunity to suggest that some such collaborators might have been Orthodox in name, by virtue of familial heritage, we can look elsewhere and see equally appalling instances of those who were Catholic in name, by virtue of familial heritage or, more appallingly, by virtue of having received orders, doing similarly horrific things to Orthodox Christians.

Croatia and the instance of the fascist Ustase, led in some instances by ordained Catholic priests - most notably Miroslav Filipović, hanged in his Franciscan robes, for war crimes, certainly comes to mind. Ask any Serbian Orthodox.

But, back to Russia in particular. Since you've elected to use Wikipedia as a historical source - an odd choice for one who declares himself a historian at heart - "During the first five years of Soviet power, the Bolsheviks executed 28 Russian Orthodox bishops and over 1,200 Russian Orthodox priests." Read more at Persecution of Christians in the Soviet Union.

The bottom line ... it is no exaggeration to suggest that, under the Communist regimes in Russia and elsewhere, hundreds of thousands of persons of religious faith and conviction, clergy and laity, of all faiths, were martyred in odium fidei, or tortured, or imprisoned, or sent to 'psychiatric hospitals'.
May their memories be eternal!

You might profit from meditating on the spiritual wisdom of a few distinguished clergy ...







In closing - both this post and this thread - I note the long-standing policy and practice, not at all unique to this forum, but observed in every forum with which I'm familiar, that members are expected to refrain from re-creating a thread on a topic that has been recently and clearly interdicted on the basis that it served no useful or valid purpose and is disruptive to the forum. It is less than 24 hours since I locked a nearly identical thread, also initiated by you.

Take note. That the matters of which you are posting are an obstacle to reunion is most damningly true in the approach that you have elected to take - find blame and fix it.

The time is long past when the Eastern Churches, Catholic and Orthodox, should be viewing the prospects for eventual reunion through a historical eyepiece besmirched with the blood of their respective martyrs. They cannot and must not be forgotten, but we cannot use them as our excuse to not end a disunity that cannot be pleasing to God.

Neither remind me that history forgotten is history apt to be repeated nor try to convince me or anyone here that you've taken a new viewpoint - looking for the equivalent of 'Righteous Orthodox', rather than death-dealing collaborators. Neither stance will wash and any further re-visitation of the subject will have repercussions.

This thread and this topic are closed!

Many years,

Neil