www.byzcath.org Forums Faith & Christian Life The Christian East & West Universal jurisdiction, Florence question

Dear Ryan,

I think Alex's words speak for themselves, so as disagreeable as it may be, I disagree with your opening assertion.

That being said, I will continue to try to comb my posts for those unnecessarily personal touches that I give them on occasion that might be cause for another taking offense.

I see nothing in this particular exchange, save the fact that I did disagree flat out, that could have been reason for taking offense. There was, in another exchange under another topic, a place where I did say something that could have been said differently. I believe the annoyance peaked there and then came here.

As for others who think negatively of me, I cannot change that nor will I try. There are those here who think well of me and they say so. We do not please everybody in this life. Best we can do is to try to please some and not totally alienate others.

I appreciate your comments.

Eli

Alex,

I agree with your assessment of the Council of Florence, because it was clearly an attempt by the Western Church to force Eastern Christians into submission (submission is often confused with communion in the West) to the Pope, and into the acceptance of various other Western theological innovations. Communion within the Church is built upon the theological qualities of charity and service, and not upon profane concepts of power over others and of legal jurisdiction.

That being said, it is my hope that in the coming talks between the Roman Church and the Eastern Orthodox Churches this fall, that there will be at least one man among the Orthodox, and preferably more than one, who is of the caliber of St. Mark of Ephesus. Such a man (or men) will be called upon to resist, by the grace of Almighty God, the Roman claims, whether those claims are focused upon the issue of the filioque or on the idea of papal universal ordinary jurisdiction, or any other peculiar theological innovation of the West since the time of the great schism. It is essential that the Orthodox Churches not prize communion with Rome over the truth of the Orthodox faith, and so they must never compromise by accepting Roman claims in connection with papal supremacy, or by accepting any of the other theological novelties that have arisen in the West during second millennium (e.g., the filioque, created grace, the reduction of the three divine hypostaseis to relations of opposition, the notion of doctrinal development, purgatory, etc.).

Communion must be built upon the unequivocal acceptance by all men of the Orthodox faith.

God bless,
Todd

P.S. - I am sure that my present post will not be received well by many on this forum, but there is nothing that I can do about that.

Dear Eli,

Clearly, the fault is with me and I apologise for the above and for coming across as being personal.

It is obvious that I'm just not cut out for this sort of discourse on the internet, as attested to my many declarations of "I'm leaving" here.

My sensitivity gets the better of me and there's obviously a cycle that gets repeated here on my part.

I have my own internet project that should keep me busy enough, in any event.

I ask for your forgiveness and I apologise to the Moderator and others here.

As a future Oblate, this does not speak well of me.

I promise to busy myself with what oblate novices should be about, I will read and study theology more so as to be better informed in future and I promise to just keep my big mouth shut here once and for all.

By the prayers of our Holy Father St Benedict, Lord have mercy!

Alex

I thought I would add to my last post by saying that, although I disagree with Eli on many issues, I respect his right to express his own opinion on theological matters. Moreover, in connection with our debates in the past (and those that we will no doubt have in the future), I am more than happy to let the chips fall where they may. It is not my intention to persuade anyone to accept my position; instead, I simply want to explain what it is that I, through the grace of God, have come to believe.

Alex,

You are far too hard on yourself. I greatly appreciate your posts, and I look forward to reading many more of them in the future.

God bless,
Todd