www.byzcath.org Forums Faith & Christian Life The Christian East & West Ever Go To Mass ?

Dear Lawrence,

Well, we are all one Body of Christ - but the Eastern Catholic Churches are Particular Churches in communion with Rome and with the Particular Latin Church.

I attend Latin Masses in the summer especially at the Martyrs' Shrine.

The other day, the Jesuit Director came and picked me up to share some Dim Sum with him!

See what kind of good terms I am on with the Jesuits?

But I feel at home in any Catholic or Orthodox Church, including, yes, the Assyrian Church

When I'm in the Latin Church, I will cross myself from left to right, but in the Ethiopian way . . .

It's the only place I can do that and get away with it without raising eyebrows

Alex

Catholics are allowed to take communion in the assyrian liturgy right? So they're close to full communion. Am I right?

Dear Remie,

First of all, why do you like Orthodox-inclining Anglicans so much?

Secondly, yes, Catholics may, under specific conditions, receive Communion in the Assyrian Church of the East.

The Patriarch of Seleucia-Ctesiphon (don't you think I should get some sort of acknowledgement here for remembering a name like that this early in the morning? ) signed one of those agreements with the Patriarch of Rome, oh, you know, what's-his-name . . .?

The agreement was on the Person of Christ and there is no longer any difference between those two Patriarchates.

We have a Chaldean priest near where I live and he often invites Assyrian priests to concelebrate the Qurbana with him.

Alex

Hmm. what i like about them is the eclectic character of their liturgy, theology and doctrine, just check this:

http://www.angelfire.com/ma/marycentral/

Here in the far flung islands of the Philippines, there's no problem if it is either a Novus Ordo or a Tridentine Mass because most of the clergy here are conservatives. In the 3 parishes that I attended Morning (Lauds) and Evening (Vespers) are being said before Mass . What was it in the "holding of hands" and "shaking of hands during the giving of 'Peace'" is bothering? Here we hold hands as sign of brotherhood during the praying of the Pater Noster while some shake hands when greeting "Peace be with you" after saying the Acclamation. Didn't we shake hands when we say "hello"? It is a way of personalizing it and it think it is much better than bowing to everybody and saying "Peace" just like the Japanese bowing and saying "arigato".

ruel

The last time that I attended Mass it was very confusing.Durring the homley the priest started quoting Budda and how he was a profet.This Priest was from India and I think that this had alot todo with the Budda thing.

Not so long ago a friend of mine brought a English video called "what we have lost" and I got surprised with what I saw. Here the RC doesn't have the problems I saw in that video. There are still many older priests in the Roman Church who celebrate mass very reverently and with a lot of dignity. The sermons that some priests give here are often very traditional, and always related to the scripture that was read(Younger priests permit some liberalisms in parishes, specially when the masses are for teenagers or young people, but nothing compared to what the video showed).

I go to mass often because I can only go to Orthodox Church in easter or Holy Week, and sometimes when I go to Mex City.

There are also younger priests that are conservatives and who celebrate mass reverently.

In the Leavenworth Kansas area, most of our Catholic (Latin) Churches tend to lean towards the liberal side. The local Catholic College of St Mary has some really left leaning tendencies but mabye this is because it is under the yoke of the Sisters of Charity. Considering the fact that they were created as a social working order BEFORE V2, you can probably guess what their like now.

The Parish I attend has a somewhat conservative priest whose preaching contains basic orthodoxy (Although sometimes hes known to go a little haywire over certain theological issues). I must commend him though on running a fairly decent shift within the parish. Despite all the alter girls, femal eukies, and occasional folk masses, things seem to be pretty solemn. For a while, we were even having occasional surges of Gregorian chanting during mass (But sadly, this has all but ceased do to the untimely passing of the previous chior director). Now, they occasionally have a variation of english chants done to Gregorian melodies.

Leavenworth used to be the seat of the Archdiocese of Kansas City, Kansas, before they moved to KCK in the forties. There used to be a beautiful Cathedral dedicated to the Immaculate Conception in town, but it unfortunatly burned down around the time of V2 and was promptly replaced with something more akin to the spirit of the times.

There is also a German parish (St. Josephs, whch has a pretty nice interior, but unfortunatly they were forced to merge with the IC parish and the latter has really rubbed off on the former (Last Good Friday, I had the priveledge of attending the Passion services their. What a treat it was to be serenaded with the resounding hymn - the "old rugged cross" done to the accompaniment of a fine piano).

Leavenworth is also priveledged to have the only Polish parish ever built in Kansas (That I am aware of). It has also been forced to merge with my present parish. WE unfortunatly have only two priest for the four parishes of this city (Can you believe that we used to be the center of the diocese). Its a great shame.

There are no Eastern Catholic parishes in Leavenworth, but I wouldnt mind it if we could import a few hundred Ukrainians in order to make one (Leavenworth is terribly un ethnic, a real bummer for a Jersey boy like me)!

In Christ,

Robert

AH yes Robert,
I think that the midwest is a goldmine for the Eastern Churches and if we could get more missions out there it would explode. I come from SE Kansas and grew up in KC and now live in the West.I have seen a certain hunger that goes unfilled in all of the young people in the region.And they turn away from the Church or toward the New Age thinking.If I could get a youth group to one Liturgy it would turn them around.
sinner,
chad

Dear Robert K.

There are actually Greek Catholics in Leavenworth (not sure if in the city or in the county). We have a family at our church that lives there.

There are also some Ukies in Atchison but quite a few across the river in St. Joseph, MO where we have a Ukrainian Catholic parish.

CIX!

Dear all,

I personally attend a Tridentine Mass most Monday evenings here in London, where I sing for the choir (there aren't many of us, from 3-6 at most). I like the Tridentine rite of mass, certainly, but I'm not blind to its faults - and I tell the Trad Latins so. It's certainly beautiful, but not perfect. Nevertheless, I almost feel it my Oecumenical duty to be present and be the token Easterner. Most of these Latins haven't a clue about the east, so the pub/dinner afterwards offers a good chance for me to give some Eastern input.

They rant about feminist clergy and I agree. They rant about women priests in Anglicanism, I agree. Then I wind them up by advocating Deaconesses and point out that they were ordained clergy and that St Nektarios of Pentapolis ordained several.

They rant about how the liturgy has dropped to an abysmal state these days, and I agree. They disagree among themselves as to when the rot set in... and I point out it started with Trent.

Yes, I ruffle a few feathers :p

I think it good to shake up their ideas on a regular basis.

Just my two lepta!

in Domino,

Edward

Yes, I notice this myself, especially among the predominatly Protestant population which truly hungers for something more mystical and asectic then their bland preaching services (IMHO, Pentecostalism is an expression of this yearning for inspiration from above).
How many people, I wonder, would openly become Eastern Catholics if only they were exposed to it.

The Catholic Church in Knasas is another sad story unto itself. Here in Leavenworth, for instance, the Catholic faith used to be very strong. This town was the center of the diocese at one time and, as I mentioned in my previous post, there was a truly magnificent Cathedral present in this city. However, Kansas Catholicism, Like(As it appears to me), All rural Catholocism, has become increasingly protestantized not only in its worship, but also doctrine. There seems to be a constant desire to "dump down" all forms of liturgy and teaching to the lowest common denominator.

This has proven disasterous for the Church in this area. As typical, mass attendence has dropped, parishes have merged, and there is a shortage of clergy. It pities me to see what was once a vibrant faith now withering away. But who else can be to blame other then the priest and Church leaders themselves who allowed this very situation to occur?

I am sure that if these Catholics had something more magnificent and spiritual then what they are presently exposed to, then they would run to Church in order to be a part of it. But sadly they are being slowly starved to death by the religious vclimate in which they live.

NOTE: I am not at all trying to lay blame or criticism of any kind upon any individual priest or person for this situation, there are a few (Okay, one) good priest that I know of who try to teach and preach the faith to people. But they must face much opposition from the more "enlightened" members of their flocks over these heroic acts of faith.

In Christ,

Robert Kearney

Aye yes, I believe I do remember seeing someone in my parish crossing themselves in the Eastern manner (Unfortunatly, I never got a chance to speak to them after Mass). It would sure be nice if Eastern Catholics of this city could establish some sort of mission here. I am sure that it would be extrememly succesful in attracting converts.

Robert