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Theophilos,

No, I am stating that constantly criticizing the past is almost never the best way to move forward. We have spent 70 years dwelling on Ea Semper and Cum Data Fuerit and the negative effects they have had on our Church. Isn�t that enough? What would you have our bishops do? Would a full-page ad in the New York Times delineating and acknowledging every mistake of the past century and public penance? Would that satisfy you? Metropolitan Judson and the Council of Hierarchs attempted to issue a Particular Law that restored the married priesthood. Wasn�t that a clear statement of their intentions? None of our current or recent bishops have ever pretended that the past was rosy or that harm has not been done to our Church. I have personally seen invitations by at least two of our bishops to married men to consider the priesthood.

I think it�s time for us to forget the harm done and forgive those that harmed us and work with our bishops to build a future that is faithful to our authentic Byzantine-Ruthenian traditions.

--

That�s a rather immature comment.

Admin

Alex,

Well stated. I just don't understand how anyone could expect that posting such personal criticism in a public forum would somehow build a good working relationship with one's bishop. It wouldn't work in the business world. Why would anyone believe it would work in the Church?

Admin

Dear Friends:

To us Roman Catholics, whatever the Master says . . .goes! Even the Pope obeys, especially where His Mother gently reminds us to do so.

(Alex, quit snickering!)

AmdG

Thanks for listening. I hope the bishops reward you well for your obedience.

Plus ca change, plus c'est la meme chose.

Theophilos,

It is not a matter of obedience (although that is important). It is a matter of finding the best way of accomplishing what needs to be done. Insults and criticism never spur people to do their best work.

Working together in charity is the best way to bring about change.

Admin

Theophilos,

It is GOD who rewards us for listening to His bishops.

That kind of investment is truly "heavenly."

You don't like it, you don't have to be Catholic.

Alex

Administrator and Alex:

The charity you both have shown me is truly exemplary! I especially appreciate your belittling (and mostly unresponsive) responses to legitimate posts! I hope and pray it does all work out in the end for the Byzantine Catholic Church... I just won't hold my breath, okay?

Thank you for reminding me, once again, of the reasons my wife and I joined the Orthodox Church.

In Christ,
Theophilos

Theophilos,

Did you expect your desire to offer personal criticism and insult to earn you praise? We have shown you much more charity than you have shown our bishops (past and present). I hope you do not criticize your Orthodox bishop with as much gusto as you have our Byzantine Catholic bishops. Criticism is not the best tool to use to make friends and build a working relationship.

Admin

quote:
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Joe Thur wrote:
Whatever it takes, another commission or no commission. As the saying goes, "Walk quietly and carry a big stick." And then another, "Just do it."
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That's a rather immature comment.

Admin

Dear Administrator,

Holy heck! "I was just agreeing with your post about amending particular laws silently ("and quietly amend it"). I absolutely agree. It only reminded me of a saying from one of our late Presidents ... and a shoe manufacturer. Geez!

As for having another commission to change our particular law AGAIN, I'd say our bishops should do what bishops ought to do - make a decision and stick to it despite the flap they would get.

Dear Father Elias,
It sounds as if you are speaking of Theophilos. However, he did not use the abbreviation "BRCC"--I did.

For the record, BRCC = Byzantine Ruthenian Catholic Church. Just like RCC = Roman Catholic Church, UGCC = Ukrainian Greek Catholic Church, OCA = Orthodox Church in America. I assure you that despite what other participants would insist are my motives, I meant no disrespect by referring to our Church as the BRCC. Is that not what it is?

And likewise for the record, I am a member in good standing (well, I'm probably not in a state of grace, but that's my business) of the Byzantine Ruthenian Catholic Church (in America), have not left it for another Church/jurisdiction and have no plans, wishes or hopes to do so. I have no desire whatsoever in this respect to be anything except what I was born and what my ancestors were. I regret, though, that I'm such a poor example of what that is.

Dear Lemko,

I apologize, I mis-understood the abbreviation. I suspected (in the context) that it stood for Byzantine Roman Catholic Church. I had seen RCC before, and thought it was an amplification of that.

Sorry....

Elias

I think we tend to use too many abbreviations. That's why I don't tell anybody I'm part of a MOP. Metropolia of Pittsburgh! Nor do I tell anyone I'm in a DUMB location. Diocese Under Metropolitan Basil!

Joe Prokopchak
archsinner

By the way. The title of this thread is Married in America. Can we abbreviate that MIA ???

Yosko Prokopchak
archsinner

I'm a subdeacon in central Kansas. Does that make me SICK?

Dear Theophilos,

If defending our bishops is wrong, then I certainly deserve your castigation of my "unresponsiveness" and "belittling."

The Orthodox Church has a much higher sense of respect for Bishops than anyone else.

I can't imagine you could or would criticize your Orthodox Bishop as the "cheirotonia" is sacrosanct.

Again, I'll defend bishops until the cows come home, freely and without payment or acknowledgement of any kind.

Alex