www.byzcath.org Forums General Discussions Town Hall Vote: Prosphora Loaves or Pre-Cut Pieces?

Dear Jim,

Incognitus can, if, as Fr. Deacon Lance affirms, he is a priest.

You and I cannot - yes, EVEN though you are a Cantor!

Alex

Dear Friends,

The issue of taking more time is actually an important one in a number of parishes I've visited.

In one parish, the priest instituted the old tradition of everyone coming to kiss the Gospel Book after the Gospel reading. I saw people angrily look at their watches.

And I agree with Incognitus - if they want to come to "Byzantine Sunday Mass" and "fulfill their obligation" and are "at risk" of joining the Latin Church - then Godspeed!

They are already Latins at heart anyway.

It is time for us to bring in people, (yes, even if they are Irish) who want to enter in fully into the experience of the Divine Liturgy.

If we revive and maintain the ancient traditions of the Orthodox Catholic East, we will get converts.

Hopefully, not strident ones . . . and especially not those who come in with prayer ropes on their arms, loudly complaining when the slightest rubric isn't followed . . .

Alex

Alex, well, I do come from the parish of St. Thomas after all.

Dear Jim,

Then there can be no doubt . . .

Alex

Dear Jim,
I do that with amazing frequency! The priest puts up with it, but his dog barks at me.

Incognitus

I give my Dad a copy of the Latin Rite Ordo for christmas and now his PP lives in fear of him , which is good it keep him on his toes. .

ICXC
NIKA

The Liturgy of the Preperation adds no time for the faithful. It is all done before the scheduled "start time". And I find that people really appreciate:

- having an opportunity to submit a list of names before DL (which I add a particle for each name),

- the fact that I dont take short cuts when I pray for them,

- the kids and adults love antidore at the end of liturgy

- and finally they love the service when I explaine it to them.

As for time; most of my parishioners also stay for a potluck brunch after DL, so that they can visit and build community. This means on average people happily stay for up to 2 - 3 even 4 hours. Those who go; go. But most people seem to think prayer and community more important than time to go home and watch the TV.

My only desire is to have more people baking prosphora in my parish. I have held one "Prosphora Workshop", but only two attended. The two who did loved it (except all the kneeding).

What I was supprised with in this thread is the size of the prosphora used in the video. I use a MUCH smaller one.

Unfortunately I do know many other priests (and some Bishops) who use and prefer pre-cuts.

Fr. Bo

For a little more on the "proskomidia" see this link from St Elias Ukrainian Catholic Church. [saintelias.com] See also this link on prosphora [saintelias.com] bread and the commemorations made at the proskomidia (before Liturgy begins).

Does your parish have a little gift shop? Does it carry prosphora seals? These can be ordered several places. For example:

Plastic Prosphora Seal [orthodoxgifts.com]

Wooden Prosphora Seals [oramaworld.com]

Any other good places to order prosphora seals? If your priest is not using a seal this would make a great gift to the parish.

Thats the size of the prosphora stamps used in the pictures at the Russian Catholic Centre in Melbourne. I have looked on a number of American Orthodox supplies shops on the net and have not seen any of that size at all. The larger Greek style stamps are there.

ICXC
NIKA

I used to carve prosphora seals--fun times! All you need is some basswood, a carving set/X-Acto knife, and a steady hand.

Fr. George Aquaro makes nice seals from resin. He sells them through his website http://www.prosphora.org/

Dave

I have discovered the reason that Byzantine Catholic Priests refuse to use proper Prosphora practices. They'd rather loaf around.

Actually the real "loafers" are the priest who use prosphora, since prosphora are smallish loaves!

Incognitus

Can a layman/laywoman be permitted to pre-cut the Prosphora loaf for the priest? If so, what prayers should he/she say as this work is being performed?

Thanks.

Michael

It really is not supposed to be happening and so there are no proper prayers for this. Sort of like those places where they have liturgy on weekdays in the Great Lent, we dont want to know about it, apart from hearing it has stopped.

ICXC
NIKA

You mean like the places where there are more weekday Liturgies during Great Lent than at other times ??