www.byzcath.org Forums General Discussions Town Hall What is your opinoin of this site?

This person has worked really hard on this site. But he has more than my mind can handle. What do y'all think, is a good reference?

http://www.geocities.com/rick_g22/index4.html#supports

Pani Rose,

I see the site does not have a very objective view of Protestant beliefs. Various non-Catholic denominations or non-denominations differ from one another in how they understand the Bible, Church authority, etc. Not all Protestants are the same, nor are they all fundamentalists. And not all fundamentalists are the same.

If one wants to win another over it won't be by arguments for the sake of rebuttal anyway, but by example, respectful dialogue, and love.

My nickel,


Blessings,

Mary Jo

Mary Jo:

Thank you for your post. I am an Episcopal Priest of the Diocese of Mississippi (Episcopal Church, USA). I'm also of Ruthenian descent and a former novice in one of the Franciscan Orders.

I stayed away from this list for a good while after unkind remarks began coming from one or two
folks about my being an Episcopalian. I have been absolutely amazed at the ignorance (of some) about our beliefs. Obviously the fact that my denomination affirms gay and lesbian persons and a Diocese (by canon law) has elected and consecrated a gay bishop has caused some problems. I don't think that's cause for nastiness.

I find that some on this list are capable of disagreeing with me and they do it in a civil manner. Others (like the neoconservatives within my own denomination) tend to be pretty nasty.

Just some thoughts. (And please, let's not start all this nastiness again!).


Fr. Mike

I am not advocating nastiness, but surely you realize that when some of us see women's ordination and homosexuality promoted by a denomination, the incongruity of it with scripture and tradition is kind of laughable in a sad sort of way. If I didn't laugh about it, I might cry. There was a time that advocating such would have gotten you dismissed as insane. I have Episcopalian friends whose very hearts have been ripped out by the actions of their church. They are in great pain, and I don't know what to tell them that will be of any help. These are good people who only wanted to live according to the church teachings they were brought up with. Now, they are somewhat lost in their own church. It's truly sad.

Gee, all I did was point out that the ECUSA is an apostate denomination that is swimming as fast as it can from what remains of Apostolic Christianity in their tradition. Sorry if the Reverend Mike found that "nasty". I'm really very ecumenical with those who seem to be trying to do the will of God. And I am no neoconservative [a truly loathsome breed}.
-Daniel

Fr. Mike may be a splendid fellow, and I don't know what he personally believes on current issues in his church. I realize there are wide ranges of opinions among Episcopalians on these issues. I am merely pointing out that I can not endorse some of the practices of that church, and that no one should expect me to. I certainly intend no nastiness toward anyone.

Forum friends,

I certainly didn't mean to get the topic going in this direction when I posted this a.m. Pani Rose asked for our opinion of a website that she listed. It was in reference to that website only that I posted my opinion as she had asked, but it certainly looks like that website and her request have been ignored by the last few posters and old arguments are being brought back solely in reaction to one another. My prayers..and apologies if I opened the door to that.

In Christ,

Mary Jo

Mary Jo,

I am sorry I posted it. It seemed to be such a busy place and more info than my mind could handle. So I figured there was enough knowledge on here to make a good judgement.

didn't mean to stir up problems either.

Pani Rose

I don't know about that site but I'm encouraged with the responses thus far to Father Mike. If he agrees with the apostates then I pray for him. If he doesn't then I suggest he leave. At any rate disagreeing with apostasy does not make one a neo-conservative.

Dan L

Rose and Mary Jo,

it was Fr. Mike who opened the door regarding the direction of the subsequent posts.

Fr Mike,

Many here have already commented upon the most recent innovation of the ECUSA.By the way, the ECUSA does not have the monopoly upon affirming persons of homosexual orientation. The Catholic Church does affirm persons of homosexual orientation. The difference may be found in the apparent official teaching of the ECUSA which affirms these persons in the sinful sexual activity, while the official teacing of the Catholic Church affirms these persons in celibate chastity. With regards to episcopal consecration, the Anglican Communion (of which the ECUSA is a member) restored the apostolic practice of consecrating married men to the episcopate. Where the ECUSA has departed is in consecrating a man who is living in a relationship with another who is not his spouse. Although Bishop Robinson defends his relationship by stating that if he could he would marry his partner, this too goes against the Pauline qualification that the bishop should be "married only once" (1 Tim. 3:2, NAB) (Bishop Robinson has already been married to a woman.)

This, then, brings up questions- would the ECUSA consecrate a man as bishop who lived openly with his mistress or would the ECUSA consecrate a divorced and remarried man as bishop? Although the latter scenario may have precedance in the Anglican Communion, I doubt the former does. (How about any other illegal "marital" relationship?) In any case, I would say that heterosexual fornicators are discriminated against in favor of their gay counterparts. IMHO, the gay card seems to trump all others.

Deacon John wrote:

(How about any other illegal "marital" relationship?) In any case, I would say that heterosexual fornicators are discriminated against in favor of their gay counterparts. IMHO, the gay card seems to trump all others. [/QB][/QUOTE]

Fr. Deacon John,

Thank you for your clarification regarding the accountability involved in the direction the posts have taken. And I do appreciate and agree with your explanation of the gay and gay bishop issue - I find the part quoted above most pertinent.

In Christ,

Mary Jo

Dear Deacon John,

I find the above quote posted by Mary Jo as some very good food for thought, and very good counter argument to those who advocate gay rights for clergy.

Dear Fr. Mike,

I am sorry that you feel unwelcome. Please do not feel that way and continue posting. I have very fond memories of attending the beautiful Episcopal services (in the equally beautiful stone English style churches) of my uncle and aunt's Church as a child.

I do lament the path the Episcopal Church has taken. My uncle, of beloved memory, left the Episcopal church he loved so much, after the first women's ordination. He never found a spiritual home to worship in after that..Although his funeral service in the beautiful Episcopal Cathedral of Manhasset, (Long Island) New York was touching.

It must be very difficult for those who do not agree with these unfortunate changes.

An option: (Orthodoxy has a Western/Anglican rite, which retains all the aspects of the beautiful Anglican Mass, under the Antiochian Orthodox Archdiocese.)


In Christ,
Alice

Fr Mike,

You are not the only Episcopalian posting here - and I suspect that there are some ,other than myself , who were at one time Anglican/Episcopalian.

Sadly some folk do not show as much courtesy to those who are not of their own branch of the Church as they should - do not let them put you off posting here .

Most of us here enjoy the breath of fresh air that comes in from time to time - we have had some really good discussions too.

Frankly - I share your agony at what your Church is going through at the present time - I hope that in time you will all do / go wherever God leads you and be comfortable in His Presence

Anhelyna - the ex Methodist ex Anglican and now for the time being RC

Slave,

I certainly agree with your hope that ECUSA will find comfort in God's leadership, but am I missing something. Is Father Mike's agony over the heresies and perversions of his Church or are they over the fact that Christians are objecting to those heresies and perversions? I thought his agony was over the resistance to the perversions. Am I wrong? Are all of us wrong?

"Frankly - I share your agony at what your Church is going through at the present time - I hope that in time you will all do / go wherever God leads you and be comfortable in His Presence"

Dan L

Alice:

The "Latin" Rite also has what is called a Rite of Anglican Use. There are congregations that use this with Rome's approval. I understand it is very beautiful.