www.byzcath.org Forums General Discussions Town Hall What is the greatest century in human history?

Just for a little fun. I know my answer is somewhat affected by my own familiarity with European history and by my interest in Patristics and Mideaval studies but still. I wonder, outside of the first century which is the greatest century since creation, what would be your choice as the greatest century in history? I will offer my choice a bit later as I see how this goes.

CDL

What is the greatest century in human history? single choice

Fourth century (33%, 8 Votes)

Fifth century (4%, 1 Votes)

Eighth century (13%, 3 Votes)

Thirteenth century (17%, 4 Votes)

Other, please explain (33%, 8 Votes)

Total Votes: 24 Voting on this poll ends: 06/08/06 02:00 PM

Why no first century ?

That was the century that Jesus Christ lived on Earth.

I.F.

Sorry, I forgot to add "outside the first century". That is, of course the greatest century in history, not simply because the Lord walked the earth, but because our Lord transformed the human race.

CDL

Hold on...I did say outside the first century. I guess I don't understand your question.

PLEASE, do not vote the first century. Every Christian knows and many who are not Christian that the First century is the greatest. Please, don't mess up the poll by voting other because you believe the first century is greater than all the others. Of course it is. That's why it is not included in the poll. That is why I wrote: "Outside the First Century".

CDL

Dear CDL,

I didn't know where to place my opinion, but I consider the 15th century the greatest. Well, it's mainly because it seems that it's the century that changed European history.

Now if you said a year, I would have said 1492, not only because of the obvious in the discovery of the New World, but because it was also the year of other occurances that seemed to have a profound effect on the known world. It was the year the Jews were kicked out of Spain and brought the vast knowledge they had from the Arabs into Northern Europe, and especially the Netherlands. They probably also started the banking system in Europe.

The Muslims were also kicked out of Spain that year, and gave Spain the opportunity to explore and expand into the New World. Also, or so I believe, one of the great Medici's died, causing a serious change in Italy, as well, or so I believe, a new Pope was declared...again, causing grave changes in Italy and Europe.

Notice how I'm not mentioning names, because frankly I'm too lazy to look them up. :rolleyes: It seems though that these things are somehow in the back of my mind for I vaguely recall a Byzantine historian mentioning an old Byzantin prophecy that humanity will go through seven milliniums, and that the then millinium was the sixth and will end in 1492. So by that account, we are living in the seventh. (It's nice to know we have a few more years to go).

Zenovia

I would be most interested in 7th century and later Heian Japan. When I was in Nara, Japan some years ago, I saw the little stone cottages that in the 7th and later centuries were the places where Christians lived and worshipped. They had a unique place in Japanese (I am American of Slovak descent if that matters) history that, unfortunately has been erased by the Japanese for the most part. However, our Japanese guide pointed these cottages out and identified them as what they were. There are a number of history books that reference the early spread of the Gospel throughout the earth including the far east. Although, at times, there were problems with synchretism, for the most part the faith was ancient Catholic and Orthodox in the generic sense which defined the undivided early Church. I know there were heresises etc., but the Great Schism was still in the future. May we reunite in Faith and good conscience.

I chose the thirteenth century. It was a close one between that and the fourth. Here are my criterea. 1. What did we learn about God in that century? and closely related 2. Was our faith and understanding of God enhanced for future contemplation?

The fourth century saw the Church come of age through the dogma of the Trinity, clarification of the divine nature of our Lord, and the writings of seven of the greatest theologians the world has ever seen. These theologians included: Athanasius, Gregory of Nyssa, Gregory the Theologian, Basil of Caesarea, John Chrysostom, and the early writings of Augustine and Jerome though the latter two belong more particularly to the fifth century. Besides that we saw the end of the first centuries of barbaric persecution and the recognition of Christianity as the state religion.

Yet, I chose the thirteenth century. Arguably this brought the epitome of Christian thought for all time. It was in this century that we saw the flowering of Realism the school founded by St. Anselm. Here we saw the creation of the University as we know it in the west. In the East we saw the flowering of Heysicasm through St. Gregory Palamas. We saw the founding of the Mendicants and the spread of and establishment of Christianity all over Europe. He saw Sts. Francis, Dominic, Bonaventure, Albert the Great and most of all we saw the rise of St. Thomas Aquinas one of the two greatest theologians in all of history. This century saw the greatest achievements of Christianity the world has ever known.

I know that it began as a rather dreadful century for East West relations but for the long run it was a grand century indeed.

CDL

If Christ's Incarnation, Resurrection, and the establishment of the Kingdom of God on earth are the greatest events since creation, I wonder if there are those who would like to give reasons why their choice of greatest century was their choice?

I gave my choice as the thirteenth because it was in that century that the Scholastics clarified the connection between faith and reason and it has stood for every century since. Imagine trying to witness for Christ to anyone without having clarity given to us by the Holy Spirit through devoted saints of old that there is a "reason for our hope". This was the command of the St. Peter when he wrote in I Peter 3

14But and if ye suffer for righteousness' sake, happy are ye: and be not afraid of their terror, neither be troubled;

15But sanctify the Lord God in your hearts: and be ready always to give an answer to every man that asketh you a reason of the hope that is in you with meekness and fear:

16Having a good conscience; that, whereas they speak evil of you, as of evildoers, they may be ashamed that falsely accuse your good conversation in Christ.

It is what St. Paul affirmed in Romans 1 when he wrote

19Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them.

20For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:

I testify to you all that there has never been, outside the Scirptures themselves, a better explication of the truths of God than the Scholastics did. Modern Christians rely almost completely upon their work and rarely recognize it or give them credit for it.

Certainly there can be support for claims made for other centuries' greatness but outside the first century itself no other century has given us so much help in proclaiming the Gospel. The more we ignore the accomplishments of the great saints of that century the poorer all of us are.

CDL

It's encouraging to see that the fourth century is well ahead of all other choices. I think we understand our history quite well. I note that on the RC and Protestant boards where I posted this the twentieth century is running well ahead of anything else. I asked the participants on the RC board why they think this might be true and reminded them of Cardinal Newman's axiom. Their answers could be interesting.

I'd love to see some more reflection from our board members here.

CDL

I was pulling for both the 4th and the 13th centuries. But since I'm still officially in the Latin Church I chose the 13th since there was the rise of the Great Saints: Francis, Dominic (of course!), Albert the Great, Thomas Aquinas, Gregory Palamas, Claire of Assisi, Zita, Raymond of Penafort, Alexander Nevski, Bonaventure, Anthony of Padua, Elizabeth of Hungary, Sava, Raymond Nonnatus, Louis IX, Gertrude the Great, Simon Stock, and Celestine V.

Great Events happened too like the 4th Lateran Council; the founding of the Servites, Franciscians, Dominicans; construction of the the great Cathedrals of Cologne and Chartres; and The Feast of Corpus Christi.

I think that some don't like the 13th century because of the sack of Constantinople and the Council of Lyons.

Don't get me wrong, the 4th century was great but I think the 13th was a bit better.

I would like to nominate the fifteenth century, but since Constantinople fell in 1453, that will not make it a popular choice here.

Each century will have its ups and downs.

Since I do not know the East as well, these are my reasons:

In 1492, Spain completed the Reconquista, after nearly 800 years of conflict. Contrary to most scholarship, the Muslims and Jews were not expelled in that year. The remains of the Muslim ruling class and many of their subjects surrendered to Queen Isabella and King Ferdinand and left the country.

Subsequently, Isabella ordered the expulsion of Muslims and Jews due to fear of the "conversos" who undermined the Faith.

Isabella supported Columbus, who discovered the New World (although the Portugese and Brazilians believe it was found in 1485 and kept quiet). The Spanish - and Portugese - then set out to evangelize America. While millions were drawn away due to Protestantism, millions more came into the Church in the Americas.

I think the 16th century was the greatest, beginning in the Age of Discovery and ending with the Union of Brest.

The explorers made it possible, for the first time, to preach the Gospel to all the Nations of the Earth.

The Union of Brest was the first step toward reunification of the Christian faith, Which for centuries had been splitting apart, East-Wast and North-South.

Or course, we still have much work to do. Much of it is mission work, toward the unChurched and underChurched. And much charity is required toward our neighbors.

Since there is a quarrel ... (insert your complaint/argument here) ... which greatly impede unity really for no other reason than that we do not wish to understand one another

From the first article of the Union of Brest:

Since there is a quarrel between the Romans and Greeks about the procession of the Holy Spirit, which greatly impede unity really for no other reason than that we do not wish to understand one another --- we ask that we should not be compelled to any other creed but that we should remain with that which was handed down to us in the Holy Scriptures, in the Gospel, and in the writings of the holy Greek Doctors, that is, that the Holy Spirit proceeds, not from two sources and not by a double procession, but from one origin, from the Father through the Son.

Dear Dr. Eric,

I recall that when computors first came out, someone decided to computorize the lives of the saints. It turned out that whenever the Church was in a sorry state, a saint would appear and correct it rather than the other way around.

According to this article in the New YOrk Times, most of the saints appeared in Italy, (which was the center of Europe at that time), and probably in the thirteenth century. I guess our Lord in all His mercy, was helping the Church adapt to a new era, especially when we consider the sack of Constantinople and the schism. :rolleyes:

Then as fate, or maybe God would have it, the black plague struck, taking a third of Europe with it.

Zenovia

I've often wondered if the Black Death of the fourteenth century had anything to do with the near collapse of Realism/Scholasticism which flourished in the thirteenth century.

CDL

Why the 20th of course. Because thats when I came along.