www.byzcath.org Forums General Discussions Town Hall 'It Is as It Was': Mel Gibson's "The Passion" gets a thumbs-up from the pope

'It Is as It Was'
Mel Gibson's "The Passion" gets a thumbs-up from the pope

by Peggy Noonan
Wednesday, December 17, 2003 1:06 p.m. EST

Here's some happy news this Christmas season, an unexpected gift for those who have seen and admired Mel Gibson's controversial movie, "The Passion," and wish to support it. The film has a new admirer, and he is a person of some influence. He is in fact the head of the Holy Roman Catholic and Apostolic Church.

Pope John Paul II saw the movie the weekend before last, in the Vatican, apparently in his private rooms, on a television, with a DVD, and accompanied by his closest friend, Msgr. Stanislaw Dziwisz. Afterwards and with an eloquent economy John Paul shared with Msgr. Dziwisz his verdict. Dziwisz, the following Monday, shared John Paul's five-word response with the co-producer of The Passion, Steve McEveety.

This is what the pope said: "It is as it was."

See the entire article at:
http://www.opinionjournal.com/columnists/pnoonan/?id=110004442

Gee,

I was going to post the same for Rose, but the Administrator was quicker on the draw.

james

Thanks Jakub and Administrator

Is that totally awesome. His words 'It is as it was', seems as though he has seen more of the Crucifixion than one could imagine. How much more to the point can one get.

I think too, the fact that repeatedly I read in articles that it changes people inside. That they are faced with what they have done in their lives that caused this. This has to be a tremendous tool of evangelization. Someone says that at one point the cross falls forward at you (I hope that is correct) and totally immerces you in the movie. It must be a wonderful yet mind boggleing thing to see.

Besides that, I need all the help I can get to recognize what part my sins played in Christ's Crucifixioin.

Rose

I will probably get flamed to no end for this, but my reaction to the Pope's statement:

How does he know?

I mean, seriously, the gospels recount the events, but hardly go into very possible minute detail.

While I'm at it (what the heck, I'm on a roll), movies like this, IMHO, detract from the deeper theological message of our yearly cycle of personal suffering and re-birth.

Movies such as this, IMHO, take the message down to the level of children who cannot understand anything beyond "every time you're bad, it makes Jesus hurt more."

It's time that we adults grew up in our outlook on our Faith and the historical truths it teaches.

(Spraying on my fire retardant),

Yours,

hal

I don't know, maybe I am a bit touchy today, but.....

Was anyone else bother by this sentance, "He is in fact the head of the Holy Roman Catholic and Apostolic Church."

or is it just me?


David, the Byzantine Catholic

I agree with you that we don't know the exact details. I do however think the movie may be a vehicle for bringing some people closer to Christ and I will be seeing it.

In Christ,
Anthony

The Holy Father has spent a lifetime lifting his own cross on a daily basis and uniting it to the Cross of Christ. Clearly he is a prayerful man who is filled with the Holy Spirit. I believe that he is eminently qualified to judge whether the movie is faithful to Holy Tradition. I don�t take �It is as it was� as a statement that the Holy Father is saying that every detail in the movie is perfectly accurate. I understand these words as meaning that the movie is completely faithful to Holy Tradition.

I�ve read quite a bit of Peggy Noonan�s writings. She is extremely talented. I don�t know what faith group she belongs to (my guess is mainline Protestant) but her writings have always exampled that she has the greatest respect for Catholics and especially for Pope John Paul II. I think it highly unlikely that she intended offense by her choice of words so I find no offense in them.

She has stated in her columns that she is a Roman Catholic, that her faith deepened after 9/11, and that she now prays the Rosary daily.

Plus she's been working on a biography of the Pope which, given her talent, should be enjoyable reading.

One of my favorite writers!

Dear Admin:

In short, if I may paraphrase you, journalists are not "infallible!"

Amado

Well, isn't he?

(She didn't say "only"!)

Dear Admin:

Well, Latin Rite tradition, anyway.

Seriously, if that's what the Pope meant, then that's what the Pope should have said. This, IMHO, would have been the wiser course.

Yours,

hal

Excuse me, but do you mean to say that an account of the Passion of Our Lord based on the Gospel accounts would not be the same in the Eastern Rite tradition? Do you have a different set of Gospels?

I am sure that the Pope meant that the movie is as faithful to the known facts as is possible. What does "rite" have to do with it? We are talking about the *source* of all the rites here.

Hey,

I think the statement was wonderful. I agree with the Admin that the pope has carried his cross faithfully in many ways. His statement validates the fact that the movie is true to the Scriptures. I don't know how he could have said it any better than he did, short and to the point.

Rose

Theist Gal:

The wink and the smile should have sent a clear enough signal that this was intended to be a light-hearted comment.

But, now that you've mentioned it, it has indeed been discussed several times in this forum that the Latin Rite tends to concentrate more upon Christ's suffering and our role in it while the Byzantine more upon the redeeming quality of the Cross and its being the road by which Christ decended into Hades, defeated death and gave us eternal life. (I cannot speak for the other Rites, sorry!).

The Gospel writings, while the cornerstone of our Faith, gave rise to several apostolic and valid "traditions." Becasue the Admin's interpretetaion of the Pope's statement was couched in terms of "tradition" I maintain that my comment was, albeit light-hearted, appropriate.

Yours,

hal