www.byzcath.org Forums General Discussions Town Hall persecution of Catholics in 16th Cent. England

I know that it was High Treason to be a Catholic in England in the 17th and 16th Centuries. The price was martyrdom. My question is: Does anyone know if there were any Eastern Catholic or Orthodox Churches in England, Ireland and Wales at that time and if they, too suffered persecution? I thank God everyday for the freedom that I have to worship and I also pray everyday for those who do not.
Only blessings, Fr. Silouan, old monk

Bless me a sinner, Venerable Father Silouan!

I've studied the Recusant period and the great religious literature it produced.

I have yet to ever come across any hint of there being any Eastern Churches in Britain and Ireland at that time that had its martyrs, however.

King Charles I, who was himself beheaded and acclaimed a martyr by Anglicans, had excellent relations with the Greek Orthodox Church and he received a Greek Bible from Patriarch Cyril Lucaris, who, as we know, was attacked as a Protestantizer by the Jesuits, having been portrayed as such by the Puritans and other Protestants of the day.

The Protestant articles of faith ascribed to him were condemned by the Orthodox Church, but the Orthodox jury is still out on whether he can be legitimately claimed as their author and if he himself was a Protestant (nonsense I say!).

Throughout this period as well Thomas Ken, Nicholar Ferrar, William Law, William of Canterbury and other Anglican divines were well acquainted with Eastern theological and liturgical works.

It was these works of the Christian East at the time of the undivided Church that led Anglicans to maintain their "High Church" heritage against Protestantism. William Laud and Charles were beheaded for this. Nicholas Ferrar's LIttle Gidding community was rampaged and destroyed by the Puritans following his death.

And,of course, the Catholics also burned Protestants for their faith, up to about 300 at one point. I remember visiting the town of Lewes where 17 Protestants were burned by "Bloody Mary" daughter of King Henry VIII . . .

260 Irish Martyrs of this period have their cause pending at Rome. The Scots, being the most civilized , only had one Catholic Martyr, Bl. George Douglas and some say this was done in error - yeah, right!

The Anglicans now have a commemoration of all Catholic and Protestant Martyrs of the Reformation Era that they hold on October 31st which is the day on which Martin Luther nailed his 95 Theses up for everyone to see and thus began the Reformation.

Tyburn Convent in London stands near the spot where about 100 Catholic martyrs, all beatified and canonized, were done to death by hanging, drawing and quartering.

They have perpetual adoration of the Blessed Sacrament 24 hours a day with an altar at the base of a reconstructed gallows that was used on that spot for years to execute people with. The "Tree of Tyburn" could hold 8 people on each of its three arms on its triangular shape . . .

The gallows is marked with the last sayings of some of the Martyrs: "Jesus, save me" "Jesus, be a Jesus for me!" "Let me not forsake Thee at this moment, Lord Jesus!"

On display nearby is a piece of the hat of St Thomas More, and some relics of Mary Queen of Scots who is not beatified, but who is highly venerated by English and Scottish Catholics.

Also there is a piece of a white shirt stained with the blood of one of the Martyrs.

The nun giving us the tour said, "Look at the high quality of this silk shirt! They wore their very best clothes on the day of their executions, you know. After all, they were going to Heaven . . ."

Alex

Glory to Jesus Christ!

Dear Father,

In Bp. Kallistos Ware's book "The Orthodox Church," he describes the attempt to set up a Greek Orthodox Church in London during the 1700s, which was answered by the English (I am quoting from memory, so forgive if not completely accurate), "Papist ways are illegal in England, whether they are done in Latin or in Greek!"

So, I don't think there was any Orthodox presence in England at the time, no. And certainly during the age of persecutions, there was no Eastern Catholic presence, because the first of the Unions to last didn't happen till the 1600s in Central Europe.

Hope that helps.

J. Michael Thompson

I believe Divine Liturgy was served in the Russian Chancery in London (as Roman Mass was in the Spanish Chancery) during this period, with an Orthodox population modest enough that this well served them.

Axios

Dear Axios,

Yes, you are right and this occurred later on in the time of Peter the Great.

Chaplains abounded and recently the Pope glorified St Claude la Colombiere who was Catholic Chaplain at St James' Palace, who was tortured but survived his ordeal.

Alex

Dear Professor Thompson,

As would be expected of one so exalted academically, you make an excellent point!

Although this did not occur in England, one John Payne, a partisan of John Wycliffe, left England and sojourned to Bohemia where he fell in with the Calixtine Hussites who were "High Church" and, for all intents and purposes, "Catholics" without the Pope.

Payne sojourned to Constatinople where he became Orthodox (as did Jan Hus' colleague, Jerome of Prague, in Latvia and we now have his Orthodox baptismal certificate).

Payne was then consecrated an Orthodox bishop with the name "Constantinos Anglikos."

He returned to Bohemia where he organized an actual Orthodox Church for the Hussites until his death, in the odour of sanctity, there.

The Czech Orthodox Church of this century has continued that tradition and has always had a strong appeal among the Hussite Protestants.

Russian Orthodox theologians of the 19th century constantly made the argument that the movement begun by Hus was a form of a return to the Cyrillo-Methodian heritage of the Bohemian and surrounding lands.

Instead of seeing Hus as a promoter of Protestantism, they saw him as an apostle for the return to Orthodoxy as evidenced by the chief characteristics of his movement: married priesthood, Communion in both Kinds, scriptures and services in a language understandable to the people etc.

Alex

[ 07-16-2002: Message edited by: Orthodox Catholic ]

Yes, Alex, I also visited Tyburn Convent and was given a tour by a nun. I also visited the house of St. Margarite Clitherow, in York. Her house is now a chapel. She was arrested for keeping "naughty things" in her house. Can you imagine what that was? A Latin Missal and a crucifix. She was crushed to death. The Scots had another martyr, St. John Olgivie, S.J. I stood on the spot where he was martyred in Glasgow.

Dear Mike,

You are right and it is all living proof that I'm definitely not infallible (I'll be meeting someone next week who is, though ).

The Catholic Cathedral in London has, as you know, a very beautiful organization into four parts with the Saints of England, Scotland, Ireland and Wales, including many of the new martyrs.

Bl. Mary Queen of Scots (she was always called "Blessed" after her death) had a long 15 decade Rosary that I viewed at Arundel Castle which she bequeathed to the Earl there. The Protestants who viewed her Rosary and Crucifix after her martyrdom called them her "play-things."

What horrified the Protestants of England at the time and were considered the quintessential symbols of being a Catholic were the Crucifix and the Rosary. All anti-Catholic cartoons of the time portray Catholics with a Cross and Rosary, and even the religious Community of the Anglican, Nicholas Ferrar (himself no friend of the Papacy!) portrayed him and his family members with rosaries and dressed in RC monastic habits!

And the case of the martyr St Nicholas Owen is most interesting.

As a carpenter, he spent 17 years building hidden shelters and "priest holes" for Catholic priests (some of these priest holes are today being used as wine cellars . . .).

He was finally captured and tortured using the thumb screw - some say it causes the worst possible pain and that there have been those who committed suicide in prison rather than continue to undergo that torture.

To this day, although the Catholic Church has canonized him a martyr and saint, the Anglicans continue to maintain that he committed suicide in prison . . .

Alex

[ 07-16-2002: Message edited by: Orthodox Catholic ]

I know that Saint Cuthbert Mayne was arrested for wearing an Agnus Dei around his neck. Since the Agnus Dei is a "Papist superstition" consecrated by the Bishop of Rome, the Saint was tried and found guilty of high treason. He was glorified as one of the Forty Martyrs of England and Wales. I am the guardian of a fragment of the Saint's skull which I venerate every day. I also wear an Agnus Dei. Hopefully I will not be arrested for high treason. I am not of the stuff of which martyrs are made.
Thank you for the wonderful replies. Silouan, old monk and Papist.

Bless me a sinner, you old Papist!

Near Martyrs' Shrine in Midland, Ontario, the French explorer Etienne Brule served Samuel Champlain.

He constantly wore an Agnus Dei. When he was taken prisoner by the Iroquois during a foray into their country, he was tortured quite viciously.

The Indians saw the Agnus Dei around his neck and tried to take it off him.

While not exactly a practicing Catholic, Etienne would have none of it and told them to leave it alone or else his God would punish them.

At that moment, some dark clouds appeared above the torture stake and the Indians became fearful.

The Chief ordered Etienne to be freed and nursed him back to health - what was left of him . . .

They then personally accompanied him back to the French and the Huron.

In the end, the Huron cooked and cannibalized him for all his womanizing. This happened not too far from where my father's farm was near Penetanguishene.

Alex