www.byzcath.org Forums General Discussions Town Hall A Tempered View of Mel's "Passion"

I believe this was already discussed at length on one of the threads above. Unless the news source above are a bunch of liars ...

Supposedly, the scholars group attained a contraband copy of the script and sent one to the USCCB with them not knowing it was hot.

Mel Gibson et al responded with legal notices ...

The USCCB never stated that the movie was anti-Semitic. That was a statement from the scholars group in conjunction with the ADL.

The Grand Pubas of Religion in Cleveland can only allude to the POSSIBILITY of idiots running out of the theatres yelling anti-Semitic slogans. This is because they think the typical pew-sitter in their houses of worship are dolts.

Joe

Or Icon was aware of the review, and cooperated with it; then got some lawyers to run interference when after the reviews came back critical.

Your version of events above is not consistent with the article you cited, which only states that Icon claimed that the script "had been obtained illegally".

There is no "unless they are liars" here at all Joe. They have written carefully about facts not in evidence and you have not.

djs, or whoever you are,

The article seems to compress several different events.

What does "djs" mean?

Joe

djs,

Here are some news articles regarding how a few Catholic scholars took the liberty to speak on behalf of the Catholic bishops. Several things seemed to have happened:
(1) the USCCB was ignored when they requested to review the script,
(2) several Catholic scholars without authorization from the bishops reviewed it in conjunction with Jewish scholars and branded it "anti-Semitic," their report was on USCCB letterhead,
(3) the Catholic bishops distanced themselves from the scholars and apologized to Mel Gibson,
(4) a "stolen" script was at the center of debate regarding Mel's legal action/threat, and
(5) the stolen script was later returned.

16 June 2003 (WENN)
Mel Gibson has received an apology from the United States Conference Of Catholic Bishops after members lashed out at his plans to make a film about the last 12 hours of Christ's life. The high clergy were skeptical about The Passion, which Gibson is directing in Italy, but a spokesman for the Conference admits members were wrong to be critical of a film that has yet to be completed. Conference heads have agreed to return all unauthorized copies of the script they had obtained to Gibson. The apology has prompted Gibson's first comments on the furor, which led to religious leaders calling his ambitious project - which will feature the ancient language of Aramaic without subtitles - anti-Catholic and anti-Semitic. He says, "To be certain, neither I nor my film is anti-Semitic. It's a movie meant to inspire, not to offend. My intention in bringing it to the screen is to create a lasting work of art and engender serious thought among audiences of diverse faith backgrounds who have varying familiarity with this story. This is a movie about faith, hope, love and forgiveness - something sorely needed in these turbulent times." Criticism was leveled at Gibson and his production company, Icon, in March when demands by the Conference of Catholic Bishops to view what was considered a controversial script were ignored.

July 1, 2003
Catholic League president William Donohue spoke today to media reports that misrepresent the sentiments of the United States Conference of Catholic Bishops (USCCB) on the subject of the Mel Gibson movie, �The Passion�:

�Several media reports, as well as comments made last night on CNN by Rabbi Marvin Hier, claim that the USCCB has branded the Mel Gibson film �The Passion� as anti-Semitic. �What I am saying is that four Catholic scholars representing the Catholic bishops,� offered Rabbi Hier of the Simon Wiesenthal Center in Los Angeles, �joined five Jewish scholars, unanimously felt there was a great deal of anti-Semitism in the script.� This account is factually wrong.

�Four Catholic scholars did review the script. But they did so without authorization from the Catholic bishops. That is why the bishops issued an apology to Gibson. Speaking for the bishops, USCCB General Counsel Mark Chopko said, �We regret the situation has occurred and offer our apologies.� Indeed, the bishops have admitted that it would be unfair to judge the movie without seeing it. Moreover, the script was stolen (by whom it is still unclear); it has since been returned to Gibson.

Joe,

Read the New Republic article if you actually want to have an idea about which facts are stipulated and which are in dispute.

All the troubles began with the New York Times Magazine article back in March 2003 regarding Mel Gibson's father.

I trust liberal biblical scholars like I trust liberal media.

Joe

Joe [or anyone else who knows]-

What precisely is it about Mel Gibson or his father that causes the media to parrot the phrase "traditional Catholics who reject Vatican II"? Are they SSPX , Sedevecantists or some such thing?

I found this article, and I feel it contradicts the so called contradictions that djs is trying to inject....

'The Passion of The Christ' more than a movie
The Baptist Standard
By George Henson
Staff Writer

DENTON--"The Passion of the Christ" will spark a stampede from theater seats to church pews, and Christians need to be ready to answer the questions the movie raises, Steve Pate believes.

Pate, associate director of missions for Denton Baptist Association, predicts a pilgrimage to America's churches not unlike what happened after terrorist attacks on the United States in 2001.

"People came to our churches in droves after 9/11, and they didn't get the answers to their questions, and they're not there now," Pate pointed out. "If we don't get them this time, we may not get another chance, because they are going to stop thinking of the church as a place where answers to life's hard questions can be found."

Pate urged pastors in his association to prepare for the film's Feb. 25 Ash Wednesday opening: "Whatever you've got planned for preaching, you'd better jettison that and answer the questions that people are going to be coming with."

Pate suggested pastors cover subjects such as the accuracy of the Bible, the humanity of Jesus, the necessity of Christ's painful death by crucifixion and evidence of the resurrection.

"This film brings up a lot more questions than it answers, but I don't see how anyone can see it and not think of it as a tool for evangelism. True, this is not the altar call, but it can be the start of a spiritual journey whereby people turn their lives to faith in Jesus Christ," Pate said.

"It really does raise more questions than it answers, but they will know the death that Jesus went through was really brutal. It's up to the church to tell them the beatings and the death on the cross were for them," Pate said.

"The film shows what Jesus suffered, but there's no transference that this was for me. There's nothing in the film like that. The church has to do that."

Denton Association has contracted with the United Artists theater at Vista Ridge Mall in Lewisville for two early showings of the movie.

While the movie will not be shown there during its release on Feb. 25, the movie will be shown one time on both Feb. 23 and 24 in a 300-seat theater. Pate is certain that churches within the association will buy those 600 seats well before those dates arrive.

"As soon as the e-mail goes out to the churches, those seats are gone," he said.

This is simply an opportunity that can't be missed, Pate said. Outreach Inc. has called the film "perhaps the best outreach opportunity in 2,000 years."

In addition to changing sermon topics, Pate also has suggested churches in his association prepare special seeker Sunday school classes so visitors can ask questions rather than just sit through a standard lesson.

In short, he believes churches should depart from their regular routine in order to accommodate people who are drawn by the film.

"I'm a huge planning person, but to quote (Henry) Blackaby, 'Our job is to see what God is doing in the world and to get on board.' It's obvious looking at newspapers, the Internet and television that this is something God is active in," Pate said.

"If churches deal with the questions these people who come are asking, there could be a huge harvest. If they don't, there will not be any."

Pate, who has seen the film, warns Christians not to see the film alone. Instead, he urges Christians to take non-Christian friends or family members with them.

"This movie is so hard to sit through that if someone says, 'I'll go and check it out, and then I'll take someone,' they won't go back," he said.

Pate said he would see the movie again, but he would do it only with a non-Christian and only because "evangelism is what makes my heart beat fast."

Pate also is cautioning youth ministers who take their youth groups to make sure all have signed permission slips in hand, because the film is rated R for the violence of the crucifixion. He also advised youth ministers to provide time for discussion after young people view the film.

"They are going to need to talk about what they have seen," he said.

The film has affected him greatly, he acknowledged.

"To see this film is a life-changing event. I will never approach the cross the same way. See this film, and you will never approach the Lord's Supper the same way. You can't. It's impossible," he said.

"But if you want it to be a life-transforming event, take a lost person to see it with you. Don't go without taking a lost person with you."

While he believes the movie is a great opportunity for the church to show itself relevant to society, Pate is concerned about what will happen if churches fail to take advantage of the opportunity.

"If we don't have answers to society's questions, there is a real danger that the culture will reinvent itself and leave the church right out of it.

"We can't blow this. This is the greatest chance for the churches to show their relevance since 9/11. My worry is that 9/11 was easy, and we blew it. This is hard."

Dear Rose,

I haven't commented much, if at all, on the movie. I haven't seen it, haven't read the script. I am not trying to inject any comments that are in any way related to the any point made in the article that you posted.

Joe made a remark:

which contained information that was presented, not as opinion, but as though the truth of it were established; in fact, little, if any, of it is certain to be true. I am sorry if my pointing the dubious nature of this information somehow offends.

I understand that some people are very excited about the movie and that some are very sensitive about anything that might be constued as a criticism of it. (Check out Amy Welborn's blog!)
Nothing of my posts here, however, has any bearing on the inspirational value or artistic quality of the movie.

Catholic Passion Outreach,
visit www.Evangelization.com [evangelization.com]

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