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Do Byzantine Rite nuns dress according to Eastern tradition? I saw nuns in Slovakia who looked very 19th century in their habit and was a little surprised when a friend said she thought they were 'Greek Catholic' (HER PHRASE NOT MINE!!!). I found this a little hard to believe.

If Byzantine Rite nuns do dress like modern Latin Rite nuns I have to ask why? How does this fit in with the integrity of one's tradition and the Holy Father's pressure on Byzantine Rite Catholics to put aside Latinisms and return to their historical traditions?

With love in Christ -
Mark, monk and sinner.

SLAVA ISUSU CHRISTU!
SLAVA NA VIKI BOHU!

Fr. Mark...

Much depends on where the sister the resides and what community she belongs to.

Here in America, the different communities have given their members a great deal of latitude in their dress.

Many of the younger sisters have taken to modest dress and no "habit" as such, not even a veil.

Those who have be members of the community for a longer period of time use an abbrievated habit, generally dark blue or black dress or skirt with white blouse and a short black veil.

There are a few of the senior members of the community who continue to wear the floor length habit both dress and veil.

The communities in Europe are wearing longer habits but have adopted the short, shoulder length veil.

Here in America, we also have a clositered Byzantine Carmelite community and they continue to wear the "traditional" habit.

As for the term GREEK CATHOLIC, this is how Eastern Rite Christians refer to themselves in Slovakia, Ukraine, Hungary and Poland. The term in Slovak and Ukrainian and Poland is GRECKO KATOLIK = GREEK CATHOLIC.

BYZANTINE CATHOLIC is a term that was adopted in the USA to differeniate ourselves from GREEK ORTHODOX.

In Slovakia, there are several stores called BYZANT that cater to Greek Catholics by selling ikons, books, cassettes and the like.

I prefer GREEK CATHOLIC myself...

JMHO....

mark

"Byzantine Rite Catholics" rather than "Eastern
Rite Christians". What about the Orthodox and Armenians in our part of Europe? Do you
believe they call themselves "Greek-Catholics"?

...and from ethnic Greeks as well. I suspect the
second cause was more important.

...and you're not alone, believe me.

Sincerely,
subdeacon Peter

SLAVA ISUSU CHRISTU!
SLAVA NA VIKI BOHU!

Ahoj Piotr!

Well, to honest, my cousins in Slovakia never let me associate with any Orthodox and I never met any Armenians in the towns I visited.

My cousins call themselves GRECKO KATOLIK.

I don't know from anything else...

S'Bohom!

marko

Medved,

If you are making reference to the good sisters at Sugarloaf, "traditional" here refers to the "traditional" brown (and white) Carmelite habit not the traditional Byzantine Orthodox habit.

Tony

A month or more before Christmas there was a most interesting discussion on one of these threads about "Orthodox in Communion with Rome" and all that it implies.

And I thought that as we restore our ORTHODOX traditions and customs, etc., that they would be ORTHODOX.

I thought it meant that as more men and women become monastics that they would look Orthodox. Monks in long black tunics (and beards) and for Church services, the klobouk and long veil. And nuns in black tunics and apostoliks (short veil and cape combined) and then a klobouk and long veil for Church services (after they are tonsured).

I thought we were supposed to be restoring our traditions.

Anyway, no matter what time of day it is, the sun in shining somewhere. And the Son of God is shining everywhere.

:p

I've seen that among Byzantine Catholics, Churches tend to create latin-style orders, or even Byzantine sections of Latin orders: Byzantine Franciscans, Redemptorists, etc.

Wouldn't it be healthy for the Eastern catholic Churches to fully restore Orthodox monasticism and to join all the Byzantine brothers from Latin Orders just as monks and nuns, as in the Orthodox Church?

(by the way, here the latin orders do wear their habits and their uniforms. I don't really understand why in Britain and the USA many nuns no longer wear habits and live like normal people. I thought that when this happened they ceased to be nuns)

\

Remie,

I agree with you completely about monastic habits and the importance of them in both the Eastern and Western Church.
Anecdotally, I remember my very blunt Irish grandmother from Ohio (who accepted all the other changes from Vatican II) but could not accept the changes in the nun's habits and the abandonment of them by some orders. She would not hesitate to let her views be known ) I felt sorry for the poor unhabited Sister who would have to listen to a tirade! This one Sister claimed that "we have to be like the people!!" and Grandma would say (minus some choice words) "why, if you are a nun????" Why, indeed!!!

Isn't is true that "tradtional" Latin habits were originally simply modest clothes?

Axios

Or attire worn by recent widows, in mourning.
Another tradition, is that, as self-governing communities, their habits were determined by members of the community themselves.

http://www.catholic-bg.org/bg/kuklen.htm

This is a good picture. It's a parish of the Bulgarian Byzantine Catholic Church, in Bulgaria. You can see Exarch Metodi Stratiev (now retired) in full Eastern clerical vestments, and the older nuns, wearing the Eastern habit. On the other side, the younger nuns wear a latin-style one. If my interprretation of the facts is correct, the younger generation seems quite latinized (and these are indeed bad news). Current Exarch Proykov almost always appears with a latin cassock and western appeareance.

You can see these pics of the younger neo-latinized generation (this is so sad):

http://www.catholic-bg.org/bg/evharistinki/evharistinki.htm

http://www.catholic-bg.org/bg/sestri_plovdiv.htm

Greetings,

In Romania, Byzantine Catholics are called Greek-Catholic.

And, I fear soem backlash here, what one wears does not make one a monk or a nun. With that said let me say that I agree that we should wear what we are supposed to wear, but lets not confuse things.

Peter

Noone is claiming that habit makes the monastic, but it is a question of the integrity of the Byzantine rite. Why dress like a Latin monastic when you have your own Eastern rites and traditions? It undermines Byzantine rite Christianity and gives a bad message.

Spasi Khristos -
Mark, monk and sinner.

When I was last in Orangeville, Ontario in the fall of 2001 at the Monastery of the Mother of God they had about half a dozen sisters living the traditional monastic life according to the Studite Typikon and wearing the traditional black Byzantine nun's habit. All were below the age of 40 and from Ukraine.

They obviously lived in a different part of the monastery as the men and came into their choir on the opposite (north) side of the chapel (the side of the icon of the Theotokos on the iconostasis) as the monks for the services who were in choir on the south side or of the icon of Christ.

Slava Bogu! This is encouraging!

Spasi Khristos -
Mark, monk and sinner.