www.byzcath.org Forums General Discussions Town Hall Saddam Captured!

I agree that the violence will escelate.that is because it is finances by Iran asand threir Iotolas. We will probably get an even bigger disaster than we have now. If we allow the Iraquis to votte, they will vote for Islamic law and union with Iran. the majority are Shiite. I thisk we picked on Iraq(a securae state at lest) because we were tooo cowardly to take on Iran whic is worse at least on a level of 10-1. All we can do is pray for our soldiers alomng with the chaplains in thier compflage vestments. I dont see any posible positive outcome except that Gbod or Divine Providence may have in store to help our bungling leaders. Clifford

I thought it was interesting yesterday when they showed the people from Tikrit and Palastine. Palastinians were upset because they have no one to pay them when their children become suside bombers. Tikrit folks were upset becasue their way of life has gone. They had the best and had it comfortably while he was in power, while the rest of the country suffered. Now they are all on equal footing.

Then in the rest of Iraq they were marching because they wanted him tried. Quite a difference!

Rose

Shlomo Lkhoolkhoon,
Let us not be hypocrites though. Here is a list of chemicals that OUR government sold to Iraq for Chemical Warfare purposes:

according to a 1994 U.S. Senate report):

* Bacillus Anthracis, cause of anthrax.

* Clostridium Botulinum, a source of botulinum toxin.

* Histoplasma Capsulatam, cause of a disease attacking lungs, brain, spinal cord, and heart.

* Brucella Melitensis, a bacteria that can damage major organs.

* Clostridium Perfringens, a highly toxic bacteria causing systemic illness.

* Clostridium tetani, a highly toxigenic substance.

Also here is a list of the companies that are US based that did business with Saddam:

AT&T
AL HADDAD ENTERPRISES, INC.
ALCOLAC INTERNATIONAL
AMERICAN TYPE CULTURE COLLECTION
ASSOCIATED INSTRUMENTS DISTRIBUTORS, INC.
AXEL ELECTRONICS
BANCA NAZIONALE DEL LAVORO
BECHTEL GROUP
BREEZEVALE, INC.
CANBERRA INDUSTRIES
CARL SCHENCK AG
CARL ZEISS
CATERPILLAR, INC.
COMTEC INTERNATIONAL, INC.
CONSARC
COPELAND INTERNATIONAL, INC.
DATA GENERAL CORP
DEKTOR COUNTERINTELLIGENCE AND SECURITY, INC.
DOW CHEMICAL
DRESSER CONSTRUCTION AND EQUIPMENT
DUPONT
E G & G PRINCETON APPLIED RESEARCH
EASTMAN KODAK CO.
ELECTRONICS ASSOCIATES, INC.
ENTRADE INTERNATIONAL, LTD.
EVAPCO
FINNIGAN MAT US
FOXBORO COMPANY
GERBER SYSTEMS TECHNOLOGY
GORMAN-RUPP
HARDINGE BROTHERS
HEWLETT-PACKARD
HIPOTRONICS
HONEYWELL
HUGHES HELICOPTER
IBM
INTERNATIONAL IMAGING SYSTEMS
INTERNATIONAL SIGNAL AND CONTROL
IONICS
KENNAMETAL, INC.
LEYBOLD VACUUM SYSTEMS
LINCOLN ELECTRIC CO.
LITTON INDUSTRIES
LUMMUS CREST, INC.
MBB HELICOPTER CORP.
MACK TRUCKS, INC.
MAHO AG
MATRIX CHURCHILL CORP.
McNEIL AKRON, INC.
MEMPHIS INTERNATIONAL, INC.
MILLER ELECTRIC
MOUSE MASTER
NCR CORPORATION
NRM CORP.
NORWALK CO.
NU KRAFT MERCANTILE CORP.
PERKIN-ELMER CORP.
PHILLIPS EXPORT
POSI SEAL, INC.
PRESRAY CORP.
PURE AIRE
REDLAKE IMAGING CORP.
REXON TECHNOLOGY CORP.
ROCKWELL INTERNATIONAL CORP.
ROTEC INDUSTRIES, INC.
SACKMAN ASSOCIATES
SCIENTIFIC ATLANTA
SCIENTIFIC DESIGN CO., INC.
SEMETEX
SERVAAS, INC.
SIEMENS CORP.
SIP CORP.
SPECTRAL DATA CORP.
SPECTRA PHYSICS
SPERRY CORP.
SULLAIRE CORP.
SWISSCO MANAGEMENT GROUP, INC.
TECHNICAL COMMUNICATIONS CORP.
TEKTRONIX
TELEDYNE WAH CHANG
THERMO JARRELL ASH CORP.
TI COATING
TRADING AND INVESTMENT CORP.
UNION CARBIDE
UNISYS CORP.
VEECO INSTRUMENTS, INC.
WILD MAGNAVOX SATELLITE SURVEY
WILTRON
XYZ OPTIONS, INC.
YORK INTERNATIONAL CORP.
ZETA LABORATORIES

Lastly, here is a list of Government agencies that did business with Saddam:

CENTERS FOR DISEASE CONTROL AND PREVENTION
CENTRAL INTELLIGENCE AGENCY
DEPARTMENT OF AGRICULTURE
DEPARTMENT OF COMMERCE
DEPARTMENT OF DEFENSE
DEPARTMENT OF STATE
NATIONAL SECURITY COUNCIL
U.S. NUCLEAR WEAPONS LABORATORIES

So let us not forget that it was us, as well as Western Europe that supplied the WMD to Saddam, and we did not object when he used them on the Iranians nor the Kurds until it was convenient to do so.

Poosh BaShlmo Lkhoolkhoon,
Yuhannon

You know, this is just one more reason why I've always admired and supported distilleries. You won't find one mentioned on the list above posted.
Lauro

Just a thought ... I do hear a lot of people saying that "we" gave Saddam all this stuff so "we" are responsible for his actions.

First of all, who's "we"? All this stuff was done in the 1970's as I understand it - I personally had not even started voting then.

Second, if all this is true and "we" meaning the U.S., did, in the past, give all these weapons to Saddam, doesn't that make it all the more reasonable that we, the U.S., should be the ones to accept the responsibility for taking him OUT of power?

Third, please ... at the time that "we" gave Saddam all this stuff, we were at war with Iran and he was (supposedly) on OUR side against them. "We" took a chance because at that time, if you recall, 52 Americans were being held hostage in Iran and "we" (actually, the great humanitarian Jimmy Carter) were trying to get them out.

So we backed what turned out to be a bad horse. Now we're shooting that horse. Not fun, but necessary.

Dear Thiest Gal,
Sometimes I think the United States "supposes" the wrong way. The US has given military trainning and weapons to the wrong people a number of times, let's also not forget about Afganistan.
I do not always agree with certain steps that the US takes when dealing with international conflicts.
Lauro

Dear Lauro,

I also seem to recall that our current US Vice-President was also involved in selling weapons and/or technology to Saddam in the recent past. America has committed and is still committing many sins on the international scene. There are times when reading international news, especially when reading news sources from outside the USA, I am almost ashamed of being an American.

Don

There's really no reason to be ashamed to be American on the contrary the United States is a beautiful country with some really nice people and beautiful places as well. I've always admired the US and its people.
I just think that certain politicians need to take a better look around the world before they open their mouths or take any action.
Lauro

So bottom line it, please. Would Iraq be a better, safer, funner place to live now if we had just stayed out and let Saddam Hussein continue in power?

Probably not. What I'm saying is that not all action taken by the US is correct nor adequate and than when certain steps that where taken incorrectly happen the consequences are usually death tolls.
Lauro

Well, take your pick (it is a terrible choice, either way) A brutal secular dictator or what we have now, anarchy where terrorists from many different Middle Eastern nations have converged , bent on continuing to destabilize and where Bush's policy has solidified views of America's imperialism in the name of "Regime Change". Not a pretty outcome either way you look at it.

First of all, we were not at "war" with Iran. Secondly, most of the weapons deals with Saddam occurred during the Reagan Administration even AFTER Saddam's gassing of Kurds in Halabja with full knowledge of this by the US Administration and the Tory government in Great Britain.
There are NO clean individuals in this story.

Yes, Don and Donald Rumsfeld was heavily involved in these 1980's deals during his time in the Reagan Administration.

Interesting topic.

This past Sunday we woke to 7 inches of fresh snow. When they finally plowed I was able to make the 12:30 PM Mass at the Roman Catholic parish in my neighborhood. In this parish they invite people to voice their prayer requests aloud (a custom I very much like).

The very first petition was by a member of the parish who is Iraqi.

With a deep Arabic accent he prayed: �In thanksgiving for the capture of the murderous dictator Saddam Hussein and for the new freedom of the people of my homeland, Iraq, let us pray to the Lord.�

It was with much gusto that the people voiced: �Lord, hear our prayer!�

For me it was a very powerful statement supporting the justness of America�s action.

Whether one supports or opposes the War in Iraq, I think the capture of Saddam Hussein is actually going to do very little to bring peace and good will to the region. The Bush administration hasen't faced up to the fact that the Iraqi's are no more interested in freedom (i,e American style democracy) then the Saudis or Pakistanis are. What's the solution ? Other than prayer I don't have an answer, but I will say that regardless of what George W Bush's ratings may be at the moment, I seriously doubt that he will be re-elected in 2004 if the situation in Iraq does not rapidly improve in the coming months.