www.byzcath.org Forums Faith & Christian Life Parish Life & Evangelization Looking for precedent

Dan,

I was able to endure 1 year in a Latin rite seminary, and it was, indeed, very monastic.

I've felt one big stumbling block to my returning to seminary (now for the BC) is my independence. I look at it this way: as a priest, I'll be alone in a parish (unless, God willing, I'm married, but that's something else altogether) fending for myself to do the work, cook, clean, etc. How does 4+ years as a veritable monastic prepare me for this?

Also, if by the Grace of God I marry, too, will I have to live in a seminary while my family lives elsewhere?

Truth is, I feel a call, but I've been through the system and I don't like it.

Places like St. Vladimir's Theological Seminary provide married apartments, and now St. Josaphat Seminary (Ukrainian Catholic) has married dorms, too.

I have no problem being a "worker priest", either, and I believe in the concept.

Andrew,

Thank you. This sounds pretty standard for any Church start I've ever studied. Perhaps there are no real variations even among Protestants.

Dan L

Dom,

Imagine what could be done if all of the Eastern Catholic seminaries were combined and we had married as well as celibate priests on campus. Imagine if we had more alternatives for second career priests.

Dan L

This is about as close to perfection as one can get in North America for a parish community: www.saintelias.com [saintelias.com]

Archpriest Roman, married parish priest, received a blessing from his Eparch (Bishop Isidore of blessed memory) to start a mission from scratch with a traditional approach to liturgy. They have deacons, subdeacons, and tonsured readers. Fr. Roman has directly impacted me more than any living clergyman in my lifetime without a doubt.

Can the rest of the hierarchy have the economia and vision of Bishop Isidore?

Dan,

to dream! I see myself as a second-career priest in the future. Funny thing is I've got a lot of priest friends in ACROD who keep putting the ACROD bug in my ear...

Diak, I often go to St. Elias's website, because it's just so good!

Sean - try going to the church sometime - it's even better, I can vouch from experience.

The overarching principles are probably the same. There are practical differences though aplenty. Being in the Eastern tradition of course means we have a lot of stuff, and to set up the worship space takes a fair amount of work and has to be done in a specific manner. The fact that we do this weekly is not just a nuisance; it actually adds a lot of wear and tear to our icons, vessels and so on. That�s actually a pretty big deal.

I think the things needed to build a church are the drive to make the gospel more visible and to reach as many people possible, along with the willingness to assume the monetary risk that if you build it they will come. It�s a big risk and a burden for a small group to shoulder.

I think another major issue for churches of the Eastern traditions is basically to decide who they are. I think that�s a major factor for each church, and of course for the wider group of churches it�s associated with.

I appreciate and love the ethnic traditions associated with Orthodoxy. To me they really ground the church in to a lived and living experience. At the same time, I�m not Greek or Serbian or Russian. My kids need to hear the liturgy in English to understand it, and truthfully I don�t want to attend the local outpost of an overseas church. Ultimately what I�m interested in seeing is an American Orthodox Church made up of all the separate traditions coming together. Slowly I think we�re getting there. We have a substantial history, we have native American saints, we have native theologians and so on. I think we have everything necessary to create a truly Orthodox church with an American identity. Ultimately I think that is what will drive the growth of the church on a larger scale.

It was never clear to me when I looked in to Eastern Catholicism what the vision was on that front. I got the feeling from some people that there was unease that the EC churches would get pigeonoled in to being ethnic enclaves and/or depots for Novus Ordo refugees. I never got the feeling from anyone that there was any type of drive to create a broad or unified American Eastern Catholic Church. To me that was troubling.

Andrew

Andrew,

It's troubling to many of us. That is one of the driving forces behind the movement that brought about the Whiting meeting. Fear has crippled us for a long long time.

With God's help...no more. If I didn't believe that our mission is to be the Mystical Body of Christ united I would have gone elsewhere. I don't believe that Christ established a united Church in order for it to be divided forever. I don't believe He raised us up to simper and whimper in the corner fearful of our own mission. I believe we are waking up. Nothing can stop a group of people who know their mission and have the vision to fulfill it.

Report is coming.

Dan L

All a play on words, right Dan? Are we really that stupid?

There are currently, I believe four or five deacon students (permanent or otherwise) studying for the Eparchy of Parma. If the married men studying at the seminary are there for the "permanent" deaconate, then why don't they comply to the eparchial statutes like the rest of us? One has to be married for five years and be forty years of age. Is there a different set of statutes for those who marry and then attend the seminary rather than the "deaconate program" used by Parma during the summer?

Smoke and mirrors.

Joe

Joe,

I do not know the inner workings of the Eparchy in this area. I don't doubt your word. I just don't know how to respond.

Dan L

Dear Dan,

Joe would know how to respond . . .

It's what might get him into trouble though!

Alex

Dear Dan:

This is hoping sincerely that your group's enthusiasm will not wane nor wither away!

Amado

Amado,

I think what the Holy Spirit is directing is that there be one visible evidence on earth of a united Church. If our group loses that mission we will fizzle and die. If we hold onto it no amount of opposition can derail it. The mission precedes the vision of its fulfillment like a purpose for a report or a novel must precede the vision of the novel's fulfillment. It makes no sense to grow if we aren't growing into the fulfillment of our mission.

It makes no sense not to ferociously pursue that mission once it is clear. The interconnection has become absolutely clear to me. If, for some unknown and incredible reason, our leaders did not have this mission for our Church the vision could not be realized in this form. If that became clear I would find another place where this mission is being fulfilled.

Dan Lauffer

Dan,

All parties involved must be honest and up front in order to get out the starting gate.

It seems like no one really knows or cares to admit how many vocations the Eparchy of Parma has.

Joe

Joe,

It is very very sad. If we can get this ship arighted or at least start to with the guidance and inspiration of the Holy Spirit honesty in this area will have to be part and parcel of the righting.

I believe we've found the key. Pray that we will be allowed to use it.

Dan L