|
2 members (melkman2, 1 invisible),
147
guests, and
21
robots. |
|
Key:
Admin,
Global Mod,
Mod
|
|
|
Forums26
Topics35,219
Posts415,295
Members5,881
| |
Most Online3,380
Dec 29th, 2019
|
|
|
|
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 4,678
Member
|
OP
Member
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 4,678 |
From The Times of London: Roman Catholicism is set to become the dominant religion in Britain for the first time since the Reformation because of massive migration from Catholic countries across the world. Catholic parishes will swell by hundreds of thousands over the next few years after managing years of decline, according to a new report, as both legal and illegal migrants enter the country. It says that the influx of migrants could be the Catholic community�s �greatest threat� or its �greatest opportunity�. While in some places the Catholic Church has responded positively, in others it has been �overwhelmed� by the scale of the challenge. The growth of Catholicism in Britain comes as the established Church of England and the Anglican provinces in Scotland, Wales and Ireland face continuing, if slow, decline.
The Catholic Church is the first port of call for thousands when they find themselves in difficulty, with up to 95 per cent from countries such as Poland being practising Catholics. Some churches find that they are being used as both job centres and social welfare offices. Most of the migrants settle in London, where some parishes are putting on Sunday Masses from 8am to 8pm to cope, the report, carried out by the Von Hugel Institute at Cambridge, found. The report calls on the Catholic hierarchy to act urgently to help the migrants and their hard-pressed clergy by investing thousands of pounds in new resources.
Officially the Church is welcoming the migrants, but nearly all bishops and clergy have been taken by surprise by the influx, which took off last year and has yet to be reflected in official Mass attendance and membership figures. But they acknowledge that the immigration is changing the face of Catholicism across Britain. From being an Irish-English church in a mindset of managing steady decline, the Church has within the space of 12 months found itself having to countenance an unprecedented expansion and change in its ethnic make-up.
Figures for 2005 show that there are 4.2 million Catholics in England and Wales, under one fifth the 25 million baptised Anglicans and double the number of Muslims. But the real Mass attendance figure is higher by many hundreds of thousands. Precise numbers are impossible to obtain because of the irregular status of so many of the migrants, who prefer to keep a low profile. Some would only talk to researchers for the report through their priests, and some clergy even refusedto be interviewed for fear of attracting attention. But the head of the Polish vicariate told The Times that the number of Poles in London had doubled since their country�s EU accession to at least 600,000. According to the report, the number recorded attending Mass represents a fraction of the total number of baptised Catholic migrants now in London. I've been very impressed with the Poles of late. It seems wherever the Polish people go, they bring with them their vibrant adherence to Catholicism and breathe new life into the Catholic Church in places like Ireland and England where it sadly seems so much of the populace feels the need to ignore Our Lord's Holy Church. They might well be England's only chance of not coming under Sharia...who knows? Logos - Alexis
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 2,735
Member
|
|
Member
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 2,735 |
Oh trust me, the faith of the Poles is infectious! One trip to Jasna Gora will convince anyone of that. Poland is truly the "last Catholic Country".
Alexandr
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 3,411
Member
|
|
Member
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 3,411 |
They might well be England's only chance of not coming under Sharia...who knows? Extend that to the rest of Europe, and remember who arrived to defend the gates of Vienna....
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 2,440
Member
|
|
Member
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 2,440 |
Dear Logos Alexis,
Praise be to God! England will not become athiestic, nor will fall under Islam...no matter how hard the Muslims try. Maybe I should say praise be to the Poles. 
I did read an old Catholic prophecy that stated, England will become Catholic once again, but it will not be all at once, but slowly.
Zenovia
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 1,516
Forum Keilbasa Sleuth Member
|
|
Forum Keilbasa Sleuth Member
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 1,516 |
The articles says that the churches become job centres and help distribute "social welfare." Gee golly whiz, being a community and helping each other in these ways are some of the sometimes forgotten foundations of core Christianity!
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 5,564
Member
|
|
Member
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 5,564 |
(Ahem) - do come and visit the Greek-Catholics in Dublin. You'll enjoy visiting a thriving community, with many couples under 40 years of age and with a raft of children and with an unshakable, matter-of-fact Faith. Problems there are, and we need your prayers and moral support. But take it from the unworthy priest who serves them: this parish is a joy.
Fr. Serge
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 166
Member
|
|
Member
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 166 |
God does have a sense of humor. Having a state church has killed the protestant faith in all of Europe not just England as it usually produces a watered down gospel. I mean come on now the head of the CHurch of England is still the queen at least in theory and the archbishop of Canteburry has no pull whatsoever witness the church splits over the homosexual question and his inability to intervene. Shudder the thought if the popes were to compromise with the hierarchs of England and give them status over the church all for communion it would have killed the catholic faith there for sure. The result was a small catholic church but a faithful one. Though church attendance is still lower in Catholcism that at early times in England it is far better than Anglicanism and has some future hope with the vibrant faith of Catholic Poles and Catholic Carribeans (60 percent of carribeans are catholic and a lot immigrate to England) I hear it is till true on any Given Sunday there are more Catholics going to mass than Anglicans going to church. Who would have thunk it after the horrors of the Reformation.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 1,045
Member
|
|
Member
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 1,045 |
better a Catholic than a Muslim England.
Much Love,
Jonn
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 3,528
Grateful Member
|
|
Grateful Member
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 3,528 |
better a Catholic than a Muslim England.
Much Love,
Jonn Amen.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 4,678
Member
|
|
OP
Member
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 4,678 |
Fr. Serge,
I never meant to denigrate your parish or the Greek-Catholic faithful of Dublin (or the Roman Catholic faithful of the rest of the country!). I was just pointing out that Catholicism by in large seems to be in a sad state of affairs on my ancestral island, and that the Poles are said to have been helping the Irish rediscover and reinvigorate the Church!
And Jonn, I'd say better a Catholic England than an anything-else England. That goes for every other country on Earth too, at least in the opinion of this Catholic...
Logos - Alexis
Last edited by Logos - Alexis; 02/16/07 04:33 PM.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 2,505
Member
|
|
Member
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 2,505 |
I seem to remember reading about a vision of a young St Dominic Savio who had a vision of England returning to the faith.
God hasten the day.
And yes I concur, the Poles have been a blessing in Scandianvia too. In Iceland alone I think they have doubled the Catholic population almost overnight.
Stephanos I
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 10,959
Moderator Member
|
|
Moderator Member
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 10,959 |
Some of the most blessed, honest, respectful, and polite people I have met, with little exception, whose very countenance, whether their age was 16 or 61, shine with holiness and kindness, have been Polish born people.
The daughter of a Greek Orthodox woman I know married a young man from Poland, and all I can say to myself everytime I see and speak to him, is that he is just pure sweetness!
Alice
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 4,268
Member
|
|
Member
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 4,268 |
The UK 2001 Official Census (next in 2011) put Islam as the most dominant non-Christian religion (about 1.5 million of them at that time); Hinduism ranked second. There could be close to 2 million Muslims in the UK by now, almost half of the Catholics!
The "surge" in the Catholic numbers was mainly due to immigration, specifically from Poland and the Caribbean. Hopefully, we can get some conversions from the Anglicans, Presbyterians, and Methodists!
Indeed, the Muslims might become the most dominant in the UK as you and I fear unless the bloody conflict between the Shiites and the Sunnis spills over from Iraq, Lebanon, the Palestine, and other areas in the Middle East to the UK and to the rest of Europe!
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 1,904
Orthodox Catholic Toddler Member
|
|
Orthodox Catholic Toddler Member
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 1,904 |
I've been very impressed with the Poles of late. It seems wherever the Polish people go, they bring with them their vibrant adherence to Catholicism and breathe new life into the Catholic Church in places like Ireland and England where it sadly seems so much of the populace feels the need to ignore Our Lord's Holy Church.
They might well be England's only chance of not coming under Sharia...who knows?
Logos - Alexis One can hope that these migrants will be the leaven that will cause the whole church to rise again. However we must remember that the Poles come from a society which, like most of our western societies, has been Christian for more than 1000 years. Today that country is predominantly Roman Catholic. That means that they probably know very little about evangelization, just like the rest of us (certainly no better than their neighbors the Ruthenians and Ukrainians). Their expanded communities may be maintenance, not mission. From what I know of Poles (I am one, and Chicago is burgeoning with them) they may have a Holy Water font on the wall near the front door, probably will do the Stations of the Cross on Fridays during Lent, pray the Divine Mercy chaplet and the Rosary at home and at church and participate in Eucharistic Adoration. In other words they are typically devout, and will try to pass this along to their babies. But we must also realize: They are probably not grabbing their neighbors by the arm and inviting them to church! They are probably not reading the Bible with friends over coffee. They don't have any better skills at sharing and spreading the Faith than anybody else. They need to learn to evangelize their neighbors, and want to do it, or this will pass like Indian Summer, a brief respite before a long cold winter. Michael, that Pole, that sinner
Last edited by Hesychios; 02/16/07 09:28 PM.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 6,586 Likes: 1
Member
|
|
Member
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 6,586 Likes: 1 |
Michael
With deference,the Poles coming over here need to learn English before they can start evangelising.
On my way to Church each Sunday I pass several small Polish foodshops - and not a thing is there in English.
In one area in England ,they are putting up road signs in Polish !!
In Aberdeen area [ I think ;)] they are getting leaflets published in Polish for those non- English speakers
|
|
|
|
|
