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Re: Anglicanism may not last out the week
Logos - Alexis #225611 03/05/07 05:07 PM
Joined: Nov 2001
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John K Offline
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John K
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Originally Posted by Logos - Alexis
John,

I've been to St. Clement's website many times, most recently two days ago. Judging from the pictures it does seem "Tridentine," but nowhere on the website (that I can find) do they give a text of the worship service they use, or even a name to it.

And Orthodox Pyrohy, in fact, didn't deny that the Traditional Latin Mass has a history that goes back to the early days of Christianity in Rome. You just said that it doesn't, but it seems historical data disagrees with you. Anyway, I don't disagree that rites develop over time, and it seems that the Roman Rite underwent quite a change sometime between the third/fourth and sixth centuries.

Orthodox Pyrohy,

I did know that the first Christian liturgies in Rome were conducted in Greek and then later switched to Latin. No argument here on that! I'm not so ignorant of basic liturgical history to not be aware of that, or to suppose you were coerced into saying that by "the Greeks." wink LOL.

Logos - Alexis

L/A, I believe St. Clement's produced their own pew book for the order of Mass which is from the Anglican People's Missal. That book is essential the Pre-VII missal with Anglicanizations! Here's a link if you want to buy it. I have a copy and it's a wonderful resource. http://anglicanbooks.com/product_info.php/products_id/49?osCsid=7c9c95f9b9148

I think that you mis-read what I wrote. The Tridentine rite was the rite that was produced out of the Council of Trent. They removed abuses and multiplication of rites that crept in during the centuries, and made other changes and additions. The council then made it THE mass of the Roman Catholic Church. Hopefully we're in agreement that the Tridentine Mass did not go back to early Christianity. wink The original Roman mass was very sober and restrained, which hardly matches the effluent Mass of the latter Middle Ages, Renaissance, and Baroque eras.
Re: Anglicanism may not last out the week
John K #225619 03/05/07 05:59 PM
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 4,678
Georgia
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Logos - Alexis Offline
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Logos - Alexis
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Thanks for the link, John. I'll definitely check it out!

I do understand that the Tridentine Mass was codified as the norm of the Roman Rite at Trent (excepting uses and variants older than 200 years, which would include the Sarum - of course we know this didn't turn out exactly so in practice).

But, the "Tridentine" Mass was just codified as *the* Roman Rite Mass at Trent. It wasn't created at Trent. At least, I didn't know of anything they took out of the Mass at Trent other than a few abuses. And I do agree that the original Roman Masses were sober and simpler, but the effects of Gallicanization on the Roman liturgy was extensive, making it far less simple and more flowery and exuberant.

And for what it's worth, Father Serge, I reeeeally don't like Low Masses!! wink

Logos - Alexis
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