www.byzcath.org Forums General Discussions Town Hall St George a saint or not?

I recently read somewhere, though I can't recall where, that St George has been expunged from the Roman Calendar because of lack of evidence that he ever existed. Can anyone vouch for this or demonstrate it is not true?

Thanks,

Jason

There is also concern for safety of Saint Nicholas of Myra too. Both might go the way of Saint Christopher and Theophilus (mentioned in the New Testament).

Eddie

Jason,

The Roman Martyrology contains every saints and blessed. Since Vatican II the revised Roman Calendar has been simplified to four ranks: Solemnity, Feast, Memorial, Optional Memorial. Some saints ranks were reduced while others are simply listed in the Martyrology with no comemoration on the Calendar. Given that there are something like 10,000 saints and we keep recognizing more and there are only 365 days in the year it is inevitable that some newer more popular ones will be added and others will drop out. But as for St. George, he is still an optional memorial for April 23 in the Roman Calendar.

And St. Christopher is still listed in the Martyrology on July 25.

Fr. Deacon Lance

In answer to the original question: Yes. Saint George is a saint. His feast was reduced to an optional memorial by the Roman Catholic church sometime in the late 1960s. The saint himself was not "removed" from the ranks of the saintly.

Saint George is still the patron saint of England, too.

He is one of several early martyrs about whom we know very little beyond their martyrdom.


I am fond of St. Sebastian, who is the patron of athletes and whose story is probably pretty similar to St. George based upon what little we actually think we know (i.e., that they were soldiers and martyred).

St George's cult varies depending on his patronage - his cult is greater in England and parts of Canada and Australia than elsewhere.

As I work with an organ donation group (the founder of which personally met with Pope John Paul II and had his torch blessed by him), I've suggested making St George patron of organ donation and we're working on that . . .

In the Eastern Churches, the Roman reorganization of the calendar doesn't affect us, Catholic or Orthodox, and St George enjoys his full, great cult unabated!

Georgia is a country named for him. Ethiopia's patronage is St George as is Russia's.

As the patron of agriculture in Eastern Europe, the agricultural year is initiated with moleben services on May 6th (old calendar St George's Day) and ends with the same on Nov. 16th (I believe) which is the feast of the dedication of the Church of St George in Kyiv.

And the phrase "St George for Merrie England" means "St George for Holy England" as "Merrie" is a form of the old English "Merrieg" meaning "Holy" (i.e. "Merry Christmas" and also "Merrie Hallowe'en").

Alex

Dear Alex,

Speaking of 'merrie olde England', I have been enamored of late with a series called 'The Tudors', showing in beautiful historical detail and brilliant acting, the very Catholic atmosphere and worship of the early days of King Henry VIII. This awesome series was produced in your country, Canada! Thank God for Canada and for its good television productions...(and that I *finally* have something to look forward to viewing).

Fondly,
Alice

Dear Alice,

Yes indeed - King Henry VIII himself always carried a "tenner" set of exquisitely carved prayer beads that are now on display at a royal museum somewhere over there.

There is also a hospital in London, run by nuns whose Order was given the property and original hospital building by His Grace, King Henry, the 8th of that name. When asked what he wanted in return for it, King Henry simply asked the nuns to say a daily rosary for him for as long as the hospital and their Order existed.

Each day until now, the nuns gather together at around 5:45 pm to say the rosary for the soul of King Henry VIII . . .

Believe it or not . . .

Fondly,

Alex (how is the Administrator doing these days, by the way?)

Well, it seems that His Majesty was a pretty good Catholic in the beginning, and the first Queen, Catherine of Aragon, was as devout a Catholic woman as they come. The series shows her in prayer, rosary in hand, and in the confessional, often. Ofcourse, her piety did not stop her intellect from seeing through the cunning cleric and close confidante of the King's court, Cardinal Wolsey!

May our good Lord have mercy on her Majesty, Queen Catherine's soul.

As for King Henry, I guess that becoming a heretic for lust can certainly affect one's mental health, sanity, and behaviour, and therefore, King Henry VIII can certainly use all the prayers for his soul that he can get. It is so sad, actually, as he was a fervent defender of the Pope and the faith in his early days.

Fondly,
Alice

A foreign usurper!

Restore the cult of St. Edmund, King and Martyr, to it's proper place of honour!

Dear Alex,

Your post about trying to make St. George the patron of organ donations made me cry. I donated my kidney to my baby 5 years ago-Joshua George Opalenik. Please pursue that and keep me posted. I tried to PM you but it did not work.

Holly

Through the intercession of St. Gianna Beretta Molla, I offer my prayers for Holly and little Joshua George. Lord have mercy on them and preserve them in strength and holiness. *smiley face of tearful admiration*

Thank you all for your responses. I actually quite forgot I had started this thread until I saw it just now! LOL Must be my meds!!!

Jason

St. George is also the patron saint of Boy Scouts.

I'm sorry, but whenever I hear the name "Edmund"... I think of Prince Edmund from the old BBC BlackAdder show...



Actually, I've been to Bury St. Edmunds, though. And my dad was stationed there.

Other than him and St. Edward the Confessor, last Saxon king, I believe, how many other kings of England are saints?

Interestingly enough, when the Lord was in the process of moving us to Birmingham, we thought my husband was going to be the manager of this home, the Knights of St George, home for the elderly. They called him on Holy Thursday and told him they could not hire him because of a change in the W.VA. state law. They called me on Good Friday(the next day) from the Post Office in Birmingham and asked me to transfer and begin work here as a full time mail carrier.

Funny isn't it, he still works for St. George - only as a deacon - the only Byzantine Catholic Church in Alabama.

So yeah, I think St. George was/is real

http://www.brookecountywvgenealogy.org/ksg.html
http://www.rootsweb.com/~wvbrooke/stgeorge.htm

Catholic Knights of America
http://www.kykofc.com/kentucky/koc_sites/int/catholic.htm

May the Good Lord bless and keep you and your little one. May a miracle shine forth, that you receive a kidney yourself through the miraculous hand of God. Jesus said, what you have done to the least of these, you did the ultimate in giving of yourself, may he also give back to you the life you have shared.

Thank you and Dr. Alex for your prayers...

My son will be 6 in a week and he is doing quite well but as a transplant patient with immunosuppression he will always have issues. He is our little miracle baby because in utero the doctors wanted us to abort both him and his twin sister, Nadia. Then shortly after birth they wanted us to DNR him, as the complications from his 9 week prematurity and the kidney failure seemed to render him incompatible for life. The best doctors in the world were on his team and they were all wrong. God granted that he should live 14 months with virtually no kidney function without dialysis until he was big enough for transplantation. The doctors who pushed us to DNR at birth apologized later on. Now the same doctors want Josh as their poster child because he looks normal (aside from being very tiny and having hearing aids), acts normal and is very -"all boy". I am more worried about him killing himself climbing trees or making skateboard jumps than about the transplant.

His favorite story is the St. George and the Dragon by Margoret Hodges-ie. the legend about St. George and England. But at the moment I have to cut this short and rescue my van from being covered in water inside and out, from said child.

Holly

Mom to Tara, Joshua, Nadia, baby deceased, Tegan, and Keara

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Speaking of 'merrie olde England', I have been enamored of late with a series called 'The Tudors', showing in beautiful historical detail and brilliant acting, the very Catholic atmosphere and worship of the early days of King Henry VIII.

Dear Alice,

I'm going to offer a critique about this series. Although the series shows the dances, (which I love), clothes and some of the customs of the times, it is faulty in other things. As so many things in our politically correct era, there is an over emphasis on sex. They show practices that would have had them hung and quartered 200 years ago, nevertheless during a time when puritanism was on the rise.

They projected a creative genius as being a practicing homosexual, in order to give the illusion that the two go hand in hand, and they disregarded the formality and politeness of the speech during that era...as well as the arrogance of the upper classes towards their 'inferiors'. Frankly I'm a little tired of our shows and their agenda's, and it's a pity I have to watch all this, in order to grab the bits and pieces of the reality of the times.

I love history. Can't they show it completely as it was, (that is without the physical deformities that were commonplace)...but at least without the crude speech, and being so sexually explicit.

Sorry about that Alice. Otherwise it is a good series.

God Bless,

Zenovia

Dear Annie,

I always loved that series. I'm waiting for it to come back on PBS. I also hope the British comedy about the German occupation in France will also return. It was hilarious! I think the problem is that only old people like me can relate to it. It was a satire of the movies of the era.

God Bless,

Zenovia

I don't know when it will be on PBS, but 'Allo 'Allo is the britcom of which you speak. It was recently released on DVD and my wife has steadily been purchasing them for me as gifts over the past couple of years.

I never tire of watching them.

Dear Holly,

This is the website of George Marcello, a dear friend of mine, who walked across Canada to promote organ and tissue donation:

www.stepbystep.ca [stepbystep.ca]

He was actually called to Rome to personally meet Pope John Paul II who blessed his torch.

I'm privileged to work with him at the Legislature to help promote his sixth annual walk, involving students, with the same torch!

Hopefully, we'll have them in the Legislature to be recognized.

My Member, Frank Klees, MPP, has worked on two pieces of legislation related to this, one on organ donation and the other to declare April 2nd "Pope John Paul II Day In Ontario" (and we have had THOUSANDS of signatures of support for the latter - 1,500 in one day and 1,800 yesterday!!). www.frank-klees.on.ca [frank-klees.on.ca]

Because of George's first name, and because "Organ Donation Awareness Week" falls on St George's Day . . . I made the suggestion . . . that George is very keen on since St George is a symbol of VICTORY!

May that same Victory be manifestly evident in your family life, as it already is in your maternal heart!

Now you got me crying . . .

Alex

Dear Holly,

May our Lord always bless you and Joshua George Opalenik. May He always watch over you, and may Saint George be your special protector and valiant warrior, fighting forever whatever obstacles may appear in your lives.

May you be truly blessed,

Zenovia

Dear Zenovia,

Sometimes I wish my son would take a little bit more to Saint Dominic Savio instead of a "warrior" like St. George. The activity level scares me a bit more than the medical condition...so at the moment I am asking St. George to intercess a tiny bit less and St. Dominic Savio, a whole bunch more:) This comes after I watched my son, teach himself how to ride his bike by squattiing on the seat, instead of sitting nicely and pedaling normally. I am very afraid that I am going to be seeing the X games in the future with this child.

Holly