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Dec 29th, 2019
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Priests Brawl at Jesus' Birthplace
CNN.com
27 December 2007
Link to original
BETHLEHEM, West Bank (AP) -- Greek Orthodox and Armenian priests attacked each other with brooms and stones inside the Church of the Nativity as long-standing rivalries erupted in violence during holiday cleaning on Thursday.
A general view from the Church of the Nativity compound in the West Bank town of Bethlehem.
The basilica, built over the grotto in Bethlehem where Christians believe Jesus was born, is administered jointly by Roman Catholic, Greek Orthodox and Armenian Apostolic authorities.
Any perceived encroachment on one group's turf can touch off vicious feuds.
On Thursday, dozens of priests and cleaners were scrubbing the church ahead of the Armenian and Orthodox Christmas, celebrated in early January. Thousands of tourists visited the church this week for Christmas celebrations.
But the clean-up turned ugly after some of the Orthodox faithful stepped inside the Armenian church's section, touching off a scuffle between about 50 Greek Orthodox and 30 Armenians.
Palestinian police, armed with batons and shields, quickly formed a human cordon to separate the two sides so the cleaning could continue, then ordered an Associated Press photographer out of the church.
Four people, some with blood running from their faces, were slightly wounded. Alexis
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Somehow my reply seems to have been deleted when the topic was moved. So I'll repost. I do remember a law in the Latin church before Vatican II that did decree excommunication for striking a priest or religious. That law is no longer on the books, or so I am told. This should still be in effect in the Latin Church. However, it was always a "simple excomunication, not reserved to the Holy See", which means that it could be absolved by simply going to confession and making amends.
Last edited by Byzantophile; 12/28/07 07:25 PM.
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Fightin' priests: You never know when the Franciscans will start a rumble! And we heard the Pope of Rome was planning just that! I heard a rumor that the Pope's broom-fightin' team will be called the Crusaders. Their motto: Walk piously and carry a big broom stick. Ed
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Fightin' priests: You never know when the Franciscans will start a rumble! And we heard the Pope of Rome was planning just that! I heard a rumor that the Pope's broom-fightin' team will be called the Crusaders. Their motto: Walk piously and carry a big broom stick. Ed Sounds suspiciously like curling, but with more excitement. 
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You can tell they are Christians by how they love one another????  I canot believe that these "men" are actually "priests".  Like 4-year-old boys, fighting with broomsticks in Church? Even as a kid, I didn't fight in Church! This is like the "Wizard of OZ" --- " wicked witches of the east"! This seems to me that this is prime example of the kind of problem that a higher authority within the Church is needed to resolve. Have any Orthodox Patriarchs / Metropolitans / Archbishops said anything about this? Or do they just accept it as the way Church is done in Jerusalem?
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Thanks for the apology. For your penance, you may drink three pints of Guinness. Or a shot of Irish whisky.
Fr. Serge
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Bless me Fr. Serge,
Can I also do penance and use a few pints of Chimay Blue ?
james
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Bless me too Fr. Serge,
I hope to offend the Irish enough to partake the penance. Perhaps the offense could be great enough that you pay for two pints of Guinness?
Terry
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Catholic Gyoza Member
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Thanks for the apology. For your penance, you may drink three pints of Guinness. Or a shot of Irish whisky.
Fr. Serge I need to come to confession, Father.
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Have any Orthodox Patriarchs / Metropolitans / Archbishops said anything about this?
Or do they just accept it as the way Church is done in Jerusalem? Why should they when their priests are doing the fighting for them. This little childish episode seems to be a sliver of the deep mistrust and hatred the churches have for one another. Can you imagine the ramifications if this brawl was between Orthodox and Catholics? To many it might be a good joke. But what if lay people ganged up on the clergy? There would be punishment to pay for including excommunication. One Ukrainiand Catholic bishop years ago excommunicated a group of his people for protesting. Ed
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Thanks for the apology. For your penance, you may drink three pints of Guinness. Or a shot of Irish whisky.
Fr. Serge Truly there can be no question as to how Erie is the Isle of Saints! I shall proceed to my penance post haste! Bless me too Fr. Serge,
I hope to offend the Irish enough to partake the penance. Perhaps the offense could be great enough that you pay for two pints of Guinness?
Terry Steady on, Terry! Offend and you may be forced to buy some pints, befriend and you may find pints bought for you!
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I think the priests could actually use a glass of Tullamore Dew.
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Have any Orthodox Patriarchs / Metropolitans / Archbishops said anything about this?
Or do they just accept it as the way Church is done in Jerusalem? I was actually thinking about their father confessors...or perhaps they don't have one?!? As I said in my other post on this thread, the 'passions' which they are allowing to run amock are very much contrary to the discipline and self restraint which the Orthodox spiritual path, as exemplified and carried down to us by the Church Fathers, advocates. In any case, in discussing this with my husband this morning, he made a good point: he said that the Greek Orthodox monks are being pharasaical. I think this is a good point...their hearts have obviously grown cold like stones, and their pride is of 'owning' the most 'real estate' (of holy sites)-- as if that somehow makes them the most favored and correct Christians above all others in the Holy Land . Alice
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In the days of St. Nicholas, if a priest or bishop engaged in a fight, then they were excommunicated.
So, St. Nicholas was briefly excommunicated for slapping Arius, who probably deserved that slap.
Where is the Rudder when we really need it?
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