www.byzcath.org Forums Faith & Christian Life The Christian East & West Involvement in Latin Parish

First off, this thread is about Eastern Catholics, not Eastern Orthodox.

That being said, second, the term "Mass" is used by some Eastern Catholics when refering to the Eucharistic Liturgy in English.

Third, if I use a term without thinking it is not me trying to force anything upon anyone; as stated above, it is me typing quickly and my mind filling in the default term. So, yes, it is merely semantics when there was no intention behind it. Thus, I do not understand why you are making a big deal.

Let me quote the OP


The lady is not wrong and while wandering off-topic is a venerable tradition of long-standing in these fora (and often produces excellent observation and commentary), it can be particularly frustrating to those not yet inclined to be as byzantine (in the secular sense of the word) in their thinking as are many here (myself included).

To paraphrase the words of a friend of mine, a former Mod at another site, sometimes a question is just a question!

When such is the case, it is not the time for would-be respondents to unearth their long-suppressed need to pontificate on matters at a level of discussion which is far beyond and above the situation presented by the OP, to polemicize, to engage in sidebar argumentation, to analyze appropriateness of usage, to tout the "o"rthodoxy or "c"atholicity of one praxis over another, or to use the well-intentioned replies of others as springboards from which to engage in lecturing or sniping at them.

Keep in mind that our sister, Olga, and her husband are

• newly aware of his familial ties to Eastern Christianity and canonical status as a Byzantine Catholic
• geographically impeded from regular participation in the communal sacramental life of a Byzantine Ruthenian (or other Eastern) Catholic parish
• accepted, participating, and involved members of a parish that is of a Sister Church sui iuris
• sincerely trying to understand what, if any, spiritual and liturgical dichotomy these circumstances pose to their desire to embrace their Eastern Christianity, even though they cannot presently practice it fully
• asking this of knowledgeable Eastern Christians and persons knowledgeable of Eastern Christianity, whom they believe would care more about giving them some insight than arguing among themselves as to appropriate liturgical terminology

That said, end the sidebars! Thoughtful, considered, knowledgable responses which will assist this family in building an Eastern Christian spiritual life - without cutting themselves off from the ability to practice spiritual life in a communal setting - are in order.

Many years,

Neil

PS And let me particularly caution those on both sides on the inadvisability of using a discussion such as this to be an excuse for pitting Eastern Catholicity against Eastern Orthodoxy or vice-versa. This site is notable for its pan-Eastern orientation and the mutual respect that is routinely accorded by those of each Church to those of the other Churches.

It is not merely what happens, it is what is expected!

I happen to agree with Irish Melkite and the others that are trying to get this thread back on topic. Keep this thread on-topic! If you have any doubts to what the topic is, reread the initial post. Any off-topic post on this thread from here on out will be simply deleted.

In IC XC,
Father Anthony+
Administrator

NO, you do not need to resign.

A very gentle word of additional advice is to "Trust but verify." I don't believe this has to change anything for your circumstances at all. But it should probably be your pastor you talk to first...

My mistake.

I really dont know what your post was in response to, but I was actually very much supportive of her. Maybe I was unclear or perhaps you misunderstood what I was saying.
Stephanos I

You know, it really is quite a shame there is not a Byzantine Catholic church in Northern MN. We are moving out there hopefully by the end of the year, and I really wish there was one as I love Divine Liturgy and attend when I can. There are a few Orthodox churches in Northern MN so I guess I'm a little surprised there are no Eastern Catholic Churches.

We aren't all in the same places! <G> And in the course of the past 30 years, our working models for parochial life and mission establishment have differed a little bit.

It's a shame that there are only a few Eastern Catholic parishes in Minnesota but it should not be a bit surprising given the inadequate resources and, perhaps, the commitment to start missions in that State.

Actually, it is understandable under the present circumstances.

Unless and until evangelization efforts are stepped up considerably by Eastern Churches (both Cathoic and Orthodox), Eastern Christianity will remain a blip in the Western hemisphere, continually eclipsed by aggressive Protestantism.

Amado

Completely understandable that there aren't many Eastern Catholic parishes in Minnesota in light of the Archbishop. [en.wikipedia.org] The ones in Minneapolis are pretty close together; Maronites are across the street from Ukrainians, and just down the street (more or less) from both St. John's and St. Mary's Russian Orthodox Cathedral. I include St. Mary's in light of its original association.

There are also Ukrainian and Maronite Churches in St. Paul.

The only Orthodox church in N. MN of which I'm aware, is in Chisholm. I presume it was founded by early 19th century Serbian immigrants who worked in the mines. Haven't researched it. Unless you count St. Cloud as Northern...which it isn't.

Olga, where do you actually live? My best guess is up in Bemidji/lakes country as you've just identified North.

Wow, I read about the Archbishop. That's a shame. If not for him it sounds like there would have been more parishes.

There are actually 2 Serbian Orthodox parishes, one in Chisholm and one in Hibbing, and an OCA parish in Chisholm. (According to the internet.) Plus, I think there are a couple of Orthodox churches in Duluth. We've done a little research while trying to figure out relocation.

There may have been more parishes but for Archbishop Ireland, but due to immigration patterns, they may not have been on the Iron Range (aka "the range"). NB: Duluth not part of range. There were a lot of Greek Catholics on the Railroads, which is why so many are in NE Minneapolis.

It's straight shot to the cities from Duluth, and not so difficult from the range. If I can drive to Hibbing without a map, you'll have no trouble with one.

Bless, Father,

Yours was not among the problematic posts and you were, in fact, very supportive and offered excellent advice vis-a-vis supplementing the children's religious education to make them conscious/aware of their ecclesial heritage. Unfortunately, as is often the case when moderating, the thread was so replete with the types of posts which I highlighted that it becomes necessary to focus on those which contribute to taking the thread off-topic.

All,

The reasons for the dearth of Eastern Catholic (or Orthodox) parishes in MN (as anywhere else) and/or the reasons why such may be concentrated in a particular locale makes for an interesting discussion. And, a year or so from now, Olga may well have discovered enough fellow ECs to have her ask us how to go about establishing a mission. But, this still begs the issue at hand.

Father Stephanos and a few others have offered the unequivocal advice that they need neither resign their current roles in the Latin parish nor withdraw from the spiritual activities in which they're engaged. Personally, I agree with those opinions but a somewhat more in-depth discussion of the "why" wouldn't be out of order and Father's suggestion of supplementing the children's religious education could be further expanded. Keep in mind that there are two adults involved here who, themselves, would likely benefit from ideas that will also assist them in becoming more conscious of Eastern Christianity and integrating our spirituality into their own lives.

Many years,

Neil

I can definitely comment on the Knights as just fine. Our immediate past State Chaplain, who held the post for years, is EC. Specifically, he's Greco-Italo-Albanian (but under the jurisdiction of the Byzantine Eparch of Van Nuys).

For most of the years I was in Pennsylvania, the Grand Knight in the local council was a BC.


We're all Catholic; participating in any other Catholic liturgy or activity is perfectly acceptable. As a practical matter, Roman Rite retreats, etc., are likely to be a necessity, for the simple reason that there are enough of them to have the institutions, and not enough ECs in most of the country.

hawk