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Holy See Rejects Feminist "Baptism"
Affirms That Church Must Follow Christ's Mandate

VATICAN CITY, FEB. 29, 2008 (Zenit.org).- The Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith clarified that two formulae for baptism that remove the masculine names for God are invalid and undermine faith in the Trinity.

The congregation's statement, made public today, responded to two questions concerning the validity of baptism conferred without referring to God the Father and Son.

The first question is: "Is a baptism valid if conferred with the words 'I baptize you in the name of the Creator, and of the Redeemer, and of the Sanctifier,' or 'I baptize you in the name of the Creator, and of the Liberator, and of the Sustainer'?"

<snip>

http://www.zenit.org/article-21925?l=english

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All persons who have been baptized with the Feminist "Baptism" need to be baptized validly and have all the other sacraments readministered.

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The sacred Names "Father, Son, and Holy Spirit" (or "Holy Ghost") are directly revealed to us in the Gospel, and specifically in the Lord Jesus Christ's injunction to baptize. What, pray, could delude anyone to think that he has some sort of privilege or "right" to change the words of Our Lord Jesus Christ?

Fr. Serge

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Fr Serge

Who knows what is in some folks' minds ?

I know a Parish Priest [ RC] who was a Seminary Rector and who will quite happily change the words of the Consecration frown

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Father Serge:

Father bless!!

These two formulae have been in use in many of the mainline Protestant Churches in the United States for the past decade and probably two. The Episcopal, Lutheran, United Methodist, and Presbyterian Churches immediately come to mind since they have invested heavily in a feminist re-interpretation of traditional Christianity.

The question now becomes what will be the reaction of those communities in the ecumenical dialogue and what will it mean for people coming from those gorups into communion with Catholics or Orthodox?

Asking for you continued holy prayers and a blessing,

BOB

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Unfortunately, the WE are the CHURCH crowd and such organizations.
Stephanos I

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Bob,
For this reason I baptize non catholics at least conditionally since now in my mind their validity is questonable.
Stephanos I

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Thanks be to God. We had to deal with angry parents on this issue, when they were informed that their child needed to be baptized.

They were mad, but not at me!

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Quote
These two formulae have been in use in many of the mainline Protestant Churches in the United States for the past decade and probably two. The Episcopal, Lutheran, United Methodist, and Presbyterian Churches immediately come to mind since they have invested heavily in a feminist re-interpretation of traditional Christianity.

I cannot speak for the USA, but I can say that in Canada the Anglican, Lutheran, Presbyterian and United churches continue to baptise using the traditional Trinitarian formula.

Can you really provide any documented evidence that the churches you mention are not using the traditional and Biblical Trinitarian formula? Just look for example at Orthodox-Anglican ecumenical dialogue.

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I would say with all due respect, it is fairly common knowledge that many of the mainline churches have adopted these unorthodox baptismal formulas, certainly in the United States. It is no big secret. I have been to Catholic services in which the Trinitarian formula is not used during the divine office, but Creator, Redeemer & Sanctifier.

People will bend over backwards not to use masculine personal pronouns, as in "God loves God's people, and God's inheritance," it get ridiculous.


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I am a cranky conservative when it comes to Bible translation language. The NRSV and NAB bibles are completely unusable as far as I am concerned, so far do they go with so-called inclusive language.






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Originally Posted by lanceg
I am a cranky conservative when it comes to Bible translation language. The NRSV and NAB bibles are completely unusable as far as I am concerned, so far do they go with so-called inclusive language.

Amen, brother!

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When I was attending St. James Catholic Church back in the early 1990s, there was this choir director who printed out the song, "Her name is Jesus." It took the pastor four months before he realized that there was a war going on while he was celebrating the Mass. The choir was singing, "Her name is Jesus" with the aid of a microphone, while the congregation bellowed, "His Name is Jesus." She did not provide the congregation with any music sheets, but they caught on to her conspiracy. She was finally terminated.

Originally Posted by lanceg
I am a cranky conservative when it comes to Bible translation language. The NRSV and NAB bibles are completely unusable as far as I am concerned, so far do they go with so-called inclusive language.

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Originally Posted by Serge Keleher
The sacred Names "Father, Son, and Holy Spirit" (or "Holy Ghost") are directly revealed to us in the Gospel, and specifically in the Lord Jesus Christ's injunction to baptize. What, pray, could delude anyone to think that he has some sort of privilege or "right" to change the words of Our Lord Jesus Christ?

Fr. Serge

Umm. Those who officially changed the words of Scripture for Byzantine Catholic worship. That's who. If bishops can change the Beatitudes - and derive a fluffy theology to justify it - then feminists can change the Trinitarian formula for baptism. Tell me where there is a difference.

Ed

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Halia12:

From my contacts and conversations with verious clergy, it's been something that one pastor will do and another will not. No one seems to take the time to press the issue for fear of being "insensitive" to women's issues. So while the official formulae may not show this, one finds it suddenly done in front of a congregation. Often it's also something that will crop up in annual conventions and someone will think it "cutting edge" so there won't be any real issue made of it. And, sadly, few people realize the implications or demand to know why it is done. Perhaps there are too many for whom Baptism is just a ritual done for infants with little thought for what it means. And that doesn't pertain to just the mainline Protestants.

Most of these ecclesial communities are wrestling with far weightier issues than Baptismal formulae. They've been bogged down in homosexual clergy ordination and homosexual blessing services among other things that have taken attention from this other area. So this issue would probably not draw a lot of attention if a pastor here and there is doing this.

In Christ,

BOB

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