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Do we have an idea? After the Holy Father allowed to have the Latin Mass celebrated I heard the LeFebvrian were returning, but do we know how many? or have they?

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I know of at least one (legitimately ordained) priest who ran his own "storefront" traditionalist parish who's come back to his local diocese. I believe he has or is trying to bring the rest of his congregation.

The actions of the local bishop were essential to bring these people back. Many years to them!

Last edited by MarkosC; 05/20/08 07:31 AM.
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Well, that will happen on an individual basis. However, the Superior General of the SSPX has ruled out any form of reunion with Rome.

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An action which should really tell us something.
Stephanos I

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COATLAXOPEUH,

I have heard that the traditionalist priests and faithful of the diocese of Campos in Brazil, who were associated with the SSPX, are now officially reconciled with Rome.

I have also heard that the SSPX themselves are now much more conciliatory towards Rome than previously. However, there are a number of issues that remain, especially since the position of the SSPX involves more than just the liturgy.

I think they also want Rome to renew the condemnations of both ecumenism and "Americanism." Possibly some other things as well.


Peace,
Deacon Richard

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Having made a number of unsubstantiated statements in my previous post, I decided to do a little research. The traditionalists of Campos were indeed reconciled with Rome, however, this took place on January 18, 2002, so it could not be attributed to recent actions by Pope Benedict XVI.

In an article dated February 2003, Bishop Bernard Fellay, the General Superior of the SSPX, laments this reconciliation, and contends that Bishop Rifan and his followers have "given up the fight." (Full article HERE [dailycatholic.org])

As I suspected, ecumenism is a big part of SSPX's reason for holding out against Rome. In the article, Bishop Fellay says,
Quote
... it is clear that the principle governing today's Rome is still to put the Council into practice as has been done for the last 40 years. Neither official documents nor general policy show any fundamental re-thinking of this principle, on the contrary, we are always being told that what the Council set in motion is irreversible, which leads us to ask why there has been a change of attitude with regard to ourselves. Various explanations are possible, but it is primarily because of the pluralist and ecumenical vision of things now prevailing in the Catholic world. According to this vision, everybody is to mix together without anybody needing any longer to convert, as Cardinal Kasper said in connection with the Orthodox and even the Jews.
Naturally, in this view the Orthodox are no more a part of the True Church than the Jews. cry


Peace,
Deacon Richard

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Yes, ecumenism is still a major concern. Recently about two months ago, I did contact the SSPX by email and they told me that basic problems have not been addressed: Vatican II is one of the biggest hurdles.

If you want to contact them by email, they will answer sincere inquiries.




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This is interesting as I seem to have had several discussions lately with Old Calendarist Orthodox, and of course it was all Ecumenism. It prompted me to learn up on what exactly "Ecumenism" is.

Interesting that SSPX and Old Calendarists are united on this front... but of course, they both reject not only each other, but also the modern versions of their respective Churches.

Schism is easy, it seems, especially when the WHOLE CHURCH is in error, but Bishop X and his loyal flock of 134 are the last members of the True Church.

I am far too sarcastic for an average Tuesday.

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Oh, yes, the faithful remnant theory.

However, here in Southern California there are intermarriages between HOCNA members and SSPX members. I cannot fathom that, but it is happening. The couples struggle about the marriage ceremony and how to raise their children as both groups are very strict. A few family members visit each other churches for major feast days.

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Originally Posted by Elizabeth Maria
However, here in Southern California there are intermarriages between HOCNA members and SSPX members. I cannot fathom that, but it is happening.

What a fundamentalist nightmare!!! crazy

Each spouse should be anathematized for allowing themselves to have socialized and fallen in love with 'heretics' shocked ('heretic' ofcourse being subjective depending on what side of the 'truer than true' church membership one comes from) laugh !!!

Alice, just adding a little good natured teasing wink

May God bless all followers of Christ-- fundamentalist, truer than true, liberal, or otherwise....for we are all His fallen Children, not one more or less beloved than the other.

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Originally Posted by Alice
What a fundamentalist nightmare!!! crazy

Each spouse should be anathematized for allowing themselves to have socialized and fallen in love with 'heretics' shocked ('heretic' ofcourse being subjective depending on what side of the 'truer than true' church membership one comes from) laugh !!!

Alice, just adding a little good natured teasing wink

May God bless all followers of Christ-- fundamentalist, truer than true, liberal, or otherwise....for we are all His fallen Children, not one more or less beloved than the other.

Knowing the beliefs and venom of both groups, I could imagine the vows for such marriages. �Do you anathematize N. in health and schism despite their heretical ways so long as you both will live?� wink biggrin

An invisible member cool

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Originally Posted by Secret Squirrel
Originally Posted by Alice
What a fundamentalist nightmare!!! crazy

Each spouse should be anathematized for allowing themselves to have socialized and fallen in love with 'heretics' shocked ('heretic' ofcourse being subjective depending on what side of the 'truer than true' church membership one comes from) laugh !!!

Alice, just adding a little good natured teasing wink

May God bless all followers of Christ-- fundamentalist, truer than true, liberal, or otherwise....for we are all His fallen Children, not one more or less beloved than the other.

Knowing the beliefs and venom of both groups, I could imagine the vows for such marriages. �Do you anathematize N. in health and schism despite their heretical ways so long as you both will live?� wink biggrin

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LOL! biggrin

Thanks for the laugh....

I always said that I liked squirrels! smile

Regards,
Alice

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Yes, sometimes reality is stranger than fiction.

I fell in love with an unbaptized protestant. It was because he was open to God and to His Holy Church that we continued our relationship and our love blossomed along with our faith. Thankfully, he was baptized about a month before our marriage.

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May I ask what HOCNA means?

Thanks!

God bless and keep you....

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Holy Orthodox Church of North America. Spelled VAGANTE!

Alexandr

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