www.byzcath.org Forums Faith & Christian Life Faith & Theology A few questions

And I'm super-white and worshiped at a Spanish Mass in Orange County. If you wanna go, go! Don't let your ethnicity keep you from going. The Eastern Catholics have been trying to get out of that "ghetto" (if I may write that) for many years and are very welcoming. So, please go if the worship appeals to you.

Dear Neil:

I remember us discussing Orthodoxy in China a few years back at the CAF and we found Internet postings showing about 2 dozens ethnic Chinese seminarians being trained somewhere in Russia.

It was pointed out, however, that there would be a difficulty in repatriating those Chinese Orthodox priests when the time comes because the (Chinese) communist government has virtually outlawed (Russian) Orthodoxy.

I think the funeral rites for that last Orthodox priest were presided over by a Catholic priest at Shanghai's Catholic Cathedral.

Our Vietnamese friend can correct me but Catholicism in Vietnam was brought by the French and is, therefore, totally Western at the outset (akin to the Spaniards bringing Catholicism to the Philippines). Eastern Christianity was "foreign" to both countries.

Amado
100% Ilocano

[quote=theophan] [quote]Theophan- haha, it looks as though we are both somewhat ignorant of each other's rite. In the Latin Rite, the Tridentine Mass is still prayed world wide and in fact, it is doing better than the Mass of Paul VI. I attend/assist the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass almost exclusively when the 1962 missal of Blessed John XXIII is in use. [/quote]

MG:

I am a Latin Catholic. Other than within the recently instituted Priestly Fraternity of St. Peter, the Liturgy of Blessed Pope John XXIII hasn't been celebrated anywhere in the Catholic world for many years. And it's only been recently that Pope Benedict has granted the Motu Proprio to allow its wider use. In most places I'm familiar with I haven't seen a 1962 Latin Mass advertised for the past 40+ years. If you have been attending the Mass of Pius V, you're probably involved with this schismatic sect.

If you're referring to the people who just had their bishops' excommunications lifted, you're talking about people who are not Catholic at all. And our bishops have taught that, preached that, and advised that since the time of the late Abp who started down that path of schism.

Altar servers? I've been an altar server in the Latin Church since about 1967 and have never been ordained an acolyte. I've even trained others to be altar servers. So your statement that only ordained acolytes could serve in such a capacity is simply false. There have been unordained altar servers in parish churches for much longer than the time you state because traditionally a priest could not celebrate Mass publicly without servers. There is an interesting story of a French priest who went to serve as a missionary in North Africa who could not celebrate Mass himself in the 19th century before he had his first convert and then he had to have special permission from Rome to have just one server. So I've got to wonder where you got this notion about altar servers having to be ordained acolytes.

On another note, we refer to the Latin Church sui juris and the Eastern Catholic Churches sui juris. We don't refer to the Latin "rite" or the Easter "rites" any longer.

BOB [/quote]

Hello...no I meant that until recently (in Church history) only ordained acolytes could serve at altar. Pope St. Pius X issued the indult far before your and my time. At least that's what I heard. Now of course, any male can serve at the altar (I do myself).

Really? In my diocese alone, I know of 4 parishes that celebrate the Latin Mass- none of them "schismatic".

MG:

In most places I know in the United States they've fought the reintroduction of the 1962 Missal tooth and nail. My bishop only gave permission to one priest a short time ago.

BOB

From what I've read and heard it is no longer up to the bishop whether or not a priest may use the Mass of Bl. John XXIII. Summorum Pontificum gave that right to the priest.

Dr. ERIC:

The only restrictions I know of are that the priest must know how to celebrate with this form. And I'm told by many that the precise rubrics for every movement and gesture have given more than a few pause. Not only that, but the language is a barrier to many. As I've stated before, there are many priests ordained since the 1974 Missal came out who have had not one class in Latin. My own pastor never had a class in the language and he'll have his 25th anniversary this coming May. We do have one priest in this diocese who has permission and celebrates each Sunday. But that's in a church that wasn't gutted in the frenzy after V2.

BOB

And I'm 100% Irish. What have our various ethnic origins to do with the matter?

Fr Serge

Are you talking about the Church Patton? We have wanted to go there. The photos are real nice.

Our Bishop has not allowed for a stable parish yet. I don't think it will be allowed any time soon.

Kathleen Elsie

Peace be upon all of you...

Theophan, you are sadly correct. Many bishops fight the reintroduction of the Mass of All Time with a vengance. However, through the grace meritted by the prayers of the faithful and our now gloriously reigning Pope, the Mass is making a huuuuge comeback. I know of at least two "Novus Ordo" priests who have begun to celebrate the Latin Mass once again. And in Paris, the attendees of traditional Mass outnumber those who attend Novus Ordo- or so I've been told. This video- which first introduced to me to tradition- seems to be ample proof!

Missa Cantata, Last Sunday after Pentecost- Church of Saint Nicholas du Chardonnet

www.youtube.com/watch?v=xK8jPgJeGuA

Fr. Ananias is celebrating the Extraordinary form in Queen of Peace at 1pm Sundays. Not surprising since he was perfectly capable and the Old Roman Catholic Church took over St. Lawrence.

Fr. Deacon Lance