www.byzcath.org Forums Mysteries: The Life of Worship Vespers, Matins & the Divine Liturgy Liturgical Translations First Impression of New Draft Translation of DL Texts

I took a quick peak at the new draft translations of the Divine Liturgy texts posted today by the Administrator. I was very impressed with what I've seen so far. There's a lot of good scholarship shown in the translation and notes.

Just a thought for those who might think this represents a minority view among Eastern Catholics. A few years ago, there was a poll here at the Forum regarding liturgical changes in the Ruthenian Church. The results of that poll can be seen here . Basically, this translation reflects what the vast majority of respondents wanted to see: a complete translation of the entire Liturgy (including the proskomide and all litanies and antiphons), restoration of "Orthodox" instead of "true faith" or "right believing", use of "mankind" vs. "us all," distancing practices "as little as possible" from Orthodox usage, respect for Prosphora traditions and not mandating that the Anaphora be taken aloud.

Again, great work!

I must agree! A quick look and I need to say it looks great!

Where is this post? I can't find it. Thanks

Jim:

The links are in this same section in a locked thread.

Bob

Two thumbs up!!

You can download PDFs of the drafts here. Look towards the bottom of the post.

Thanks I look forward to comparing it with the current text.

Jim

I've only looked over it briefly, but it looks good.

It looks good, but the phrase Theotokos or Birthgiver of God or God-Bearer is not present in this text, but that discussion is for another thread.

Esteemed Administrator: You and your group have done excellent work!!! Bishop John does not have the authority to rescind the RDL all by himself. He can, however, authorize the use of alternate liturgicons. Some still use the 1964. But yours would be better!!!

John,

Just wondering...It's been about four months since the study texts were posted. What kind of responses are you getting?

Are there any updates or news to share?

I can't complete my download, it always says "interrupted".

That's unusual (both files are under 1 M) - unless you're using a dial-in modem.

Try putting your cursor over the link and "right-clicking" to save it without opening it. Then don't do anything else during the download.

If that doesn't work send me an email at forum@byzcath.org and I'll send them via email as attachments.

The response has been tremendously positive! I have been utterly amazed at the wonderful comments from the clergy (including bishops) and laity, including both Byzantine Catholic and Orthodox. A small number of priests (outside the Ruthenian Church) are even using the texts (which really helps the review process).

The most positive and encouraging response to date has been from officials in Rome (I had sent them copies of the Study Texts). The thank you letter commented that they were received with "great pleasure" and offered best wishes for the "ministry".

This, of course, changes nothing in the Ruthenian Church of Pittsburgh, where the RDL remains the official text. Yet it does offer a bit of hope that the RDL might be short lived, and might be replaced with texts and rubrics that are more authentic. Perhaps the next Metropolitan of Pittsburgh will lean Byzantine, and lead the Ruthenian Church in rediscovering the jewel of its own liturgical tradition. Please continue to pray daily for the Ruthenian Church.

John,

That's great news!

One thought: perhaps the new Metropolitans of both the ACROD and Ruthenian Churches could work together to set up a process to develop a common Divine Liturgy text of the Ruthenian Rescension for both Churches? I'm sure this project you've been working on would be very useful for such a project.

I know going back to Metropolitan Nicholas and the BCC back in what I remember in the early 1990's were working toward a common DL Text...I recall seeing some of the work back around 1992(?)...it was actually the changeable parts (tropars, kondaks & prokeminons) that I saw...when I was a candidate to the priesthood for the eparchy of Passaic and working as a student assistant at the Center for Eastern Christian Studies at the University of Scranton...I also was more recently (within the last 2 years) asked my impressions of the Revisions that occured several years ago, if I remember correctly, all of the Priests of ACROD were given a "Teal Terror" with the thought that this could possibly be a "starting point" for trying to get the common text and music train going...Well that went nowhere once people actually looked at what the "Teal Terror" translations, had to offer...

Again, I can't say much on the music settings, what I remember is they are closer to much of what is used in ACROD...the inclusive language was more an issue...

These drafts are great. But will they ever officially replace the RDL. Has these drafts been taken to higher authorities?. There great to read, but for now that's all. They would do more good if they were officially mandated.

So from what I have read on these forums. Both the Ruthenian and Melkite churches have some pretty bad "new" translations. Maybe it would be be best if we just purchased Orthodox translations for study and use. I found this website that has a pretty good modern translation. But done by the Greek Orthodox Churches. Have you seen this.

http://newbyz.org/

Divine Liturgy Here.

http://www.newbyz.org/complete_liturgy_book.pdf