www.byzcath.org Forums General Discussions Town Hall Eastern Orthodox leader urges ascesis to reverse climate change

Still curious how to see "distibutism" enacted without compelling a society to adopt it.

As for myself, I suspicion a little more ascesis - and a few other things - would reverse my liklihood of winding up in purgatory for a very long time.

Amen, amen, amen. From the people who think they know best what I should eat, what I should drink, what I should do about exercise, spending my money, supporting the latest social experiment--the list goes on.

It's like hearing from my wife "What are you going to do today?" at 6:30 a.m. when I haven't even focused on the fact that the Good Lord has allowed me another day to get it right.

"Can't everybody just leave everybody else alone?" Man, you said a mouthful with those eight words!

theophan

Theophan, I appreciate the sentiment but since "no man is an island" it only goes so far. Still, if I had to make a choice between libertarianism and socialism I'd choose the former knowing that it can only go so far.

You are a Christian are you not? Do you propose that society embrace Christianity? How, without compulsion?

Don't misunderstand me. I do think I know how you should eat, live, etc. I even think I know what God you should worship. I just know better than to try to make you.

Exactly. While I'm very sympathetic to the concerns stated by Irish Ruthenian, and while I used to support what I call "democratic socialism," I have come to see systems such as socialism and distributism as being largely utopian. Capitalism is indeed riddled with flaws, and sometimes brings out the worst in people. However, I don't see how socialism or distributism can work without resorting to force.

Socialism doesn't really work even when they do resort to force.

It seems like the most rudimentary fact of human nature that you can't really force anybody to do anything, at least not for long and least of all an entire population. If you want to get any program enacted, the way to do it is to get a lot of other people to think like you do. Why anyone should wonder about this is beyond me. As various countries unravel before our eyes, isn't it plain to see that a society only continues when everybody shares the same goals and basic assumptions?

If you want to enact distributism across society, start by enacting it for yourself. Tell a friend. If it catches on, it will be enacted across society. If it doesn't catch on, no force will bring it into being.

I think that the history of the 20th century reveals this to be the case. What I should have stated is that I don't see how socialism or distributism can be implemented on a wide scale without resorting to force.

In that case, distributists will say that distributism, touching the question of justice, is both the logical economy of a Christian society which has justice for a goal, and a method for reaching that goal. It will be implemented only to the degree that such a society exists.

Again, without a universal Catholic Monarchy supported by all Distributism cannot work.

Socialism is the greatest threat to Catholicism and Religion that man has ever devised.

Look at the Bolsheviks - Communism and all the socialist countries who murdered priests and faithful alike in droves.

The only thing with more hatred for Christians are Muslims.

So, you're saying this is just another crackpot theory that has never worked and never can work this side of the Parousia (after which it will not be necessary)? Who'd a thunk it?

I don't understand why you think this. I don't, and I am a monarchist.

The only alternative to righteousness is force. That's our choice. Either a Universal Catholic Monarchy accepted by all or force.