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Bartholomew I: 50 years of "love" and "harmony" between Catholics and Orthodoxby Bartolomeo I Asia News 10/11/2012 http://www.asianews.it/news-en/Bartholomew-I:-50-years-of-love-and-harmony-between-Catholics-and-Orthodox-26057.html The sole representative of Orthodoxy at the ceremony for the start of the Year of Faith, the Ecumenical Patriarch of Constantinople retraces the stages of the search for unity between Catholics and Orthodox, and between the Orthodox themselves, favored by the Second Vatican Council. The full speech of Bartholomew I during the celebration in St. Peter's Square. [ Linked Image] Vatican City (AsiaNews) - "Love" and "desire for harmony", "dialogue" and "mutual respect" are the values witnessed by the presence of Bartholomew I at the ceremony that began the Year of the Faith and marked the 50 years since the Opening of the Second Vatican Council. The Ecumenical Patriarch of Constantinople is the sole representative of Orthodoxy to be invited to the ceremony. Moreover - as he himself recalled at the end of the Mass celebrated by Benedict XVI - the Patriarchate of Constantinople has always been committed to ecumenism, which was the mainspring of the Second Vatican Council. In his speech - which we publish below in full - Bartholomew I retraced the steps that led up to the opening of the theological dialogue between Catholics and Orthodox. At the same time he points out that the Vatican Council also catalysed tensions in the search for unity even among the Orthodox Churches. Unity among Christians, that for which Christ prayed before the "Gethsemane experience," is a function of the common witness of the "message of salvation and healing for our brethren: the poor, the oppressed, the marginalized in world created by God". "In the current turmoil of violence, separation, and brokenness that is escalating between peoples and nations, may the love and desire for harmony we profess here, and the understanding we seek through dialogue and mutual respect, serve as a model for our world". Here is the full address by the Ecumenical Patriarch of Constantinople: Beloved brother in the Lord, Your Holiness Pope Benedict; Brothers and Sisters; As Christ prepared for His Gethsemane experience, He prayed a prayer for unity which is recorded in the Gospel of Saint John Chapter 17 verse 11: ". . . keep through Your name those whom You have given Me, that they may be one as We are". Through the centuries we have, indeed, been kept in the power and love of Christ, and in the proper moment in history the Holy Spirit moved upon us and we began the long journey towards the visible unity that Christ desires. This has been confirmed in Unitatis Redintegratio §1: Everywhere large numbers have felt the impulse of this grace, and among our separated brethren also there increases from day to day the movement, fostered by the grace of the Holy Spirit, for the restoration of unity among all Christians. Fifty years ago in this very square, a powerful and pivotal celebration captured the heart and mind of the Roman Catholic Church, transporting it across the centuries into the contemporary world. This transforming milestone, the opening of the Second Vatican Council, was inspired by the fundamental reality that the Son and incarnate Logos of God is "...where two or three are gathered in his name" (Matt.18.20) and that the Spirit, who proceeds from the Father, "...will guide us into the whole truth." (John 16.13). In the 50 years that have intervened, we recall with vividness and tenderness, but also with elation and enthusiasm, our personal discussions with episcopal members and theological periti during our formative time - then as a young student - at the Pontifical Oriental Institute, as well as our personal attendance at some special sessions of the Council. We witnessed firsthand how the bishops experienced a renewed awareness of the validity - and a reinforced sense of the continuity - of the tradition and faith "once for all delivered to the saints" (Jude 1.3). It was a period of promise and hope for your Church both internally and externally. For the Orthodox Church, we have observed a time of exchange and expectation. For example, the convocation of the first Pan-Orthodox Conferences in Rhodes led to the Pre-Conciliar Pan-Orthodox Conferences in preparation for the Great Council of the Orthodox Churches. These exchanges will demonstrate the unified witness of the Orthodox Church in the modern world. Moreover, it coincided with the "dialogue of love" and heralded the Joint International Commission for Theological Dialogue between the Roman Catholic and the Orthodox Church, which was established by our venerable predecessors Pope John Paul II and Ecumenical Patriarch Dimitrios. Over the last five decades, the achievements of this assembly have been diverse as evidenced through the series of important and influential constitutions, declarations, and decrees. We have contemplated the renewal of the spirit and "return to the sources" through liturgical study, biblical research, and patristic scholarship. We have appreciated the struggle toward gradual liberation from the limitation of rigid scholasticism to the openness of ecumenical encounter, which has led to the mutual rescinding of the excommunications of the year 1054, the exchange of greetings, returning of relics, entering into important dialogues, and visiting each other in our respective Sees. Our journey has not always been easy or without pain and challenge, for as we know "narrow is the gate and difficult is the way" (Matthew 7.14). The essential theology and principal themes of the Second Vatican Council - the mystery of the Church, the sacredness of the liturgy, and the authority of the bishop - are difficult to apply in earnest practice, and constitute a life-long and church-wide labor to assimilate. The door, then, must remain open for deeper reception, pastoral engagement, and ecclesial interpretation of the Second Vatican Council. As we move forward together, we offer thanks and glory to the living God - Father, Son and Holy Spirit - that the same assembly of bishops has recognised the importance of reflection and sincere dialogue between our "sister churches". We join in the ". . . hope that the barrier dividing the Eastern Church and the Western Church will be removed, and that - at last - there may be but the one dwelling, firmly established on Christ Jesus, the cornerstone, who will make both one" (Unitatis Redintegratio §18). With Christ as our cornerstone and the tradition we share, we shall be able - or, rather, we shall be enabled by the gift and grace of God - to reach a better appreciation and fuller expression of the Body of Christ. With our continued efforts in accordance with the spirit of the tradition of the early Church, and in the light of the Church of the Councils of the first millennium, we will experience the visible unity that lies just beyond us today. The Church always excels in its uniquely prophetic and pastoral dimension, embraces its characteristic meekness and spirituality, and serves with humble sensitivity the "least of these My brethren" (Matt. 25.40). Beloved brother, our presence here signifies and seals our commitment to witness together to the Gospel message of salvation and healing for the least of our brethren: the poor, the oppressed, the forgotten in God's world. Let us begin with prayers for peace and healing for our Christian brothers and sisters living in the Middle East. In the current turmoil of violence, separation, and brokenness that is escalating between peoples and nations, may the love and desire for harmony we profess here, and the understanding we seek through dialogue and mutual respect, serve as a model for our world. Indeed, may all humanity reach out to 'the other' and work together to overcome the suffering of people everywhere, particularly in the face of famine, natural disasters, disease, and war that ultimately touches all of our lives. In light of all that has yet to be accomplished by the Church on earth, and with great appreciation for all the progress we have shared, we are, therefore, honored to be invited to attend - and humbled to be called to address - this solemn and festive commemoration of the Second Vatican Council. It is fitting that this occasion also marks for your Church the formal inauguration of the "Year of Faith", as it is faith that provides a visible sign of the journey we have traveled together along the path of reconciliation and visible unity. In closing, Your Holiness, Beloved Brother, we wholeheartedly congratulate you - together with the blessed multitude assembled here today - and we fraternally embrace you on the joyous occasion of this anniversary celebration. May God bless you all.
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The Patriarch's words are irenic and full of grace, love and wisdom and without compromise to our Orthodoxy. A special 'Axios' to him for his courage in saying what he said since no doubt the naysayers, haters and anti's will fill the net and their pulpits with their usual stuff in response.
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The Patriarch's words are irenic and full of grace, love and wisdom and without compromise to our Orthodoxy. A special 'Axios' to him for his courage in saying what he said since no doubt the naysayers, haters and anti's will fill the net and their pulpits with their usual stuff in response. Axios! I've already seen naysayers on the goarch Facebook, but outweighed by "likes" there. Spoken in Italian no less. [ youtube.com] Also, eight Patriarchs of Eastern Catholic Churches [ romereports.com] at Holy Synod of Bishops opening Mass 0:31
Last edited by likethethief; 10/12/12 08:11 AM.
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The Patriarch's words are irenic and full of grace, love and wisdom and without compromise to our Orthodoxy. A special 'Axios' to him for his courage in saying what he said since no doubt the naysayers, haters and anti's will fill the net and their pulpits with their usual stuff in response. Axios! I've already seen naysayers on the goarch Facebook, but outweighed by "likes" there. Spoken in Italian no less. [ youtube.com] Also, eight Patriarchs of Eastern Catholic Churches [ romereports.com] at Holy Synod of Bishops opening Mass 0:31 Put me down as naysayer: Bartholomew I: 50 years of "love" and "harmony" between Catholics and Orthodox
by Bartolomeo I Asia News 10/11/2012 http://www.asianews.it/news-en/Bartholomew-I:-50-years-of-love-and-harmony-between-Catholics-and-Orthodox-26057.html
The sole representative of Orthodoxy at the ceremony for the start of the Year of Faith, the Ecumenical Patriarch of Constantinople retraces the stages of the search for unity between Catholics and Orthodox, and between the Orthodox themselves, favored by the Second Vatican Council. The full speech of Bartholomew I during the celebration in St. Peter's Square.
...For the Orthodox Church, we have observed a time of exchange and expectation. For example, the convocation of the first Pan-Orthodox Conferences in Rhodes led to the Pre-Conciliar Pan-Orthodox Conferences in preparation for the Great Council of the Orthodox Churches... This is only going to confirm the opinion of the majority of the Orthodox (basically, everyone but the Phanar and its devotees) that this "Great Council of the Orthodox Churches" comes to no more than an unnecessary opportunity for mischief. The Orthodox have unity. The Phanar seeks a unity based on communion with it (on a well known model), not the Orthodox. Ever since the '60s the Orthodox Churches have dismissed the idea of a "Great Council" to solve problems and differences which do not call for such drastic measures. The wanna be supreme pontiff of the East (we already have a pope, in Alexandria) just will not take no for an answer. But that remains his problem, not ours. There is a reason why EP Bartholomew was the only one invited. No one else has an agenda which would prompt their attendance.
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The Orthodox have unity. The Phanar seeks a unity based on communion with it (on a well known model), not the Orthodox. In other words, the Orthodox reject their own canonical ecclesiology?
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Maybe said it elsewhere here, but when I watched these two men together like in Constantinople there is no doubt in my own mind that they have not shared the Eucharist together. And some other Catholic-Orthodox hierarchs too. Leaders can achieve union on their levels, it the people who are the obstacle.
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The Orthodox have unity. The Phanar seeks a unity based on communion with it (on a well known model), not the Orthodox. In other words, the Orthodox reject their own canonical ecclesiology? No, the Orthodox hold to their own canonical ecclesiology while the Phanar tries to create its own, after the fashion of Old Rome. The Orthodox have been out of communion with Constantinople several times. Or rather, its patriarch has been out of communion from the Orthodox several times. The Orthodox Diptychs of the Catholic Church even in the Phanar have 14 names (there are really 15, but that's another discussion). Not one.
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Maybe said it elsewhere here, but when I watched these two men together like in Constantinople there is no doubt in my own mind that they have not shared the Eucharist together. And some other Catholic-Orthodox hierarchs too. Leaders can achieve union on their levels, it the people who are the obstacle. Yes, as they were to the Arians, Macedonians, Nestorius, Eutyches, the Monothelites and Iconoclasts. We know that Metropolitan Nicolai Corneanu of Banat "shared the Eucharist." We also know-or should know-the judgement of the Holy Synod of Romania on that.
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No, the Orthodox hold to their own canonical ecclesiology while the Phanar tries to create its own, after the fashion of Old Rome. Really? And what do the Councils actually say about who has the primacy, and how that primacy is exercised? You take as a given that the situation as it evolved post-1453 is somehow normative, when it is, in fact, a terrible aberration. The concept of a multitude of fractious autocephalous Churches was never considered under the Pentarchy of the First Millennium, and most of the patriarchates erected since 1453 have done so strictly by non-canonical means, and accepted only when it became apparent that the status quo ante was not tenable. In short, actual Orthodox ecclesiology today is one gigantic act of oikonomia, a wholesale waiving of the canons on Church governance.
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No, the Orthodox hold to their own canonical ecclesiology while the Phanar tries to create its own, after the fashion of Old Rome. Really? And what do the Councils actually say about who has the primacy, and how that primacy is exercised? As the First, Second, Third, Fifth, Sixth and Seventh Ecumenical councils make clear, primacy does not determine communion, as the primates who had it both in Old and New Rome were cast out of communion by the decrees of the Fathers at those Councils. Nothing defines communion as communion with the anathematized. You take as a given that the situation as it evolved post-1453 is somehow normative, when it is, in fact, a terrible aberration. Since I take the post-1453 Rum Milet-i as a terrible aberration, and not a given, I have't a clue as to what you are talking about. do you? The concept of a multitude of fractious autocephalous Churches was never considered under the Pentarchy of the First Millennium Seems you don't know the history of the Pentarchy of the First Millenium. and most of the patriarchates erected since 1453 have done so strictly by non-canonical means Oh? Moscow/Russia, erected by strictly canonical means (the Pope of Alexandria saw to that) 1592 Serbia, re-established by strictly canonical means, 1920. Romania, established by strictly canonical means, 1925 That leaves only Bulgaria, whose patriarchate was "abolished" by means of questionable canonicity twice before 1453 and once after. The Phanar questioned its re-establishment in 1953, but no one else did. Or has. The reestablishment of the Catholicate of Georgia came on even firmer canonical grounds. and accepted only when it became apparent that the status quo ante was not tenable. Sort of like Old Rome's total capitulation as to the autocephaly of New Rome in 1215 (when, of course, the Latin Crusaders were occupying it). In short, actual Orthodox ecclesiology today is one gigantic act of oikonomia, a wholesale waiving of the canons on Church governance. If you say so, and are listening to the Phanar's spokesmen.
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I've already seen naysayers on the goarch Facebook, but outweighed by "likes" there. I mean no offense by saying this, and I have no personal problems with the Ecumenical Patriarch's comments, but Facebook "likes" really are not a good measure of anything, especially since there is no corresponding Facebook button for "dislikes." 
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Communion in the Orthodox faith is what is important. After all, hierarchs come and go, but the Orthodox faith remains the same.
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Communion in the Orthodox faith is what is important. After all, hierarchs come and go, but the Orthodox faith remains the same. Hehe. Yeah, I hear that. There's been hierarch changes a plenty in Eastern Catholic churches to be sure.
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There is a reason why EP Bartholomew was the only one invited. No one else has an agenda which would prompt their attendance. He was not the only Orthodox invited, and present, there. It's interesting that that erroneous statement continues to be repeated. And Metropolitan Hilarion of Volokolamsk's address [ mospat.ru] to the Synod of Bishops was mentioned and published a number of places on line at the time. SUMMARY - LIST OF PARTICIPANTS [ vatican.va] SYNODUS EPISCOPORUM BULLETIN XIII ORDINARY GENERAL ASSEMBLY OF THE SYNOD OF BISHOPS 7-28 OCTOBER 2012 The New Evangelization for the Transmission of the Christian Faith This Bulletin is only a working instrument for the press. Translations are not official. English Edition [ vatican.va] skip to the bottom C. LEADERS OF CHURCHES AND ECCLESIAL COMMUNITIES
- His Holiness BARTHOLOMEW I, Archbishop of Constantinople, Ecumenical Patriarch (TURKEY) - H. G. Rowan Douglas WILLIAMS, Archbishop of Canterbury, Primate of all England and the Anglican Communion (GREAT BRITAIN)
D. LIST OF FRATERNAL DELEGATES
Ecumenical Patriarchate - H. Em. LEO [Makkonen], Archbishop of Karelia and all Finland (FINLAND)
Patriarchate of Moscow - H. Em. HILARION [Alfeyev], Metropolitan of Volokolamsk, President of the Department of Public Relations of the Church of Moscovite Patriarchy (RUSSIAN FEDERATION)
Serbian Orthodox Patriarchate - H. G. IRINEJ [Bulović], Bishop of Bačka (SERBIA AND MONTENEGRO)
Romanian Orthodox Patriarchate - H. Exc. SILUAN [Şpan], Bishop of the Romanian Orthodox Diocese in Italy (ITALY)
Armenian Apostolic Church Catholicossate of the Holy See of Etchmiadzin - Rev. F. Massis ZOBOUIAN, Director of the "Christian Education Department of the Catholicosate of the Holy See of Cilicia" (LEBANON) Armenian Apostolic Church Catholicossate of the Holy See of Cilicia - H. Exc. GEVORG [Saroyan], Dean of "Gevorgyan Theological Faculty" (ARMENIA) ...
Last edited by likethethief; 10/30/12 02:21 AM.
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What I've come to learn: The various Eastern Orthodox jurisdictions exercise and recognize jurisdiction in variety - some give their chief heirarch full control with a rubber stamp Synod; others give no control to the heirarch and he is merely a spokesman for the Synod; most are somewhere in the middle. Their views of what the EP's role is varies from one extreme to the other, sometimes even among heirarchs within the same autocephalous/autonomous Church - usually this perspective is colored by which view is most beneficial to them or whatever it is they feel strongly about.
It seems to me that the Tradition of a strong primus is just as authentic as the Tradition of a strong Synod; and both views are equally orthodox. How this plays into relations with Rome is anyone's guess.
The Oriental Orthodox also have variety regarding this, and each Church decides for themselves how Rome is to be approached and treated. It varies from the Coptic Church's sometime strict rejection of even baptism (sometimes, not always) of all Catholics (this varies as well; some accept Eastern Catholic rites, while rejecting Western rites); to the Armenian and Syriac acceptance of even Holy Eucharist and everything in between (save full, visible Communion)...
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