www.byzcath.org Forums Faith & Christian Life Faith & Theology Question about the Lestovka

Dear Anhelyna,

With respect to those seven pieces, that prayerbook is as helpful as Incognitus!

And if they are moveable, perhaps they're playing a game of "hide and seek?"

Good that you've settled down, finally!

I'm actually afraid of you when you aren't . . .

Alex

I picked up two lestovky when I visited the True, I mean Old, Rite parish in Kyiv. (Alex, thanks again for putting me in touch with Taras Burnos.) Neither lestovka had the seven "moveable pieces". I have no idea why this is so. Our best bet would probably be to just ask an Old Believer...

Σώσον, Κύριε, καί διαφύλαξον η�άς από τών Βασιλιάνικων τάξεων!

Dear Kobzar,

Yes, Taras looks so young to be such an "Old Believer!"

Alex

Lestovka! logon to: www.easternchristian.com [easternchristian.com] it is Eastern Christian Supply Company, in Etna, CA, they have some very beautiful Lestovka!

Г.И.Х.С.Б.п.м.г.!

I, too, was disappointed that the four flaps of my lestovka were sewn together.

Upon closer examination a few days ago I noticed the stiching was just in the corners and where the lower flaps went under the upper ones. Spreading open the upper flaps with some needle-nose pliers I soon convinced myself that if I opened up the upper flaps there was no fear of the lower ones falling off. I very carefully snipped the stitching and... my lestovka didn't fall apart! Even better, I found that the strip of leather to which the lower flaps were attached was threaded through seven small pieces of leather. They don't slide around easily, but they can be moved.

All these years I felt short-changed, but now I know I have a fully functioning lestovka.

Спаси Хрыстос!

Σώσον, Κύριε, καί διαφύλαξον η�άς από τών Βασιλιάνικων τάξεων!

Well I'm glad that's clarified things for you, Kobzar .

But I'm still puzzled <scratching head>

So we now have a lestovka with moveable bits that had been concealed .

So according to Alex the seven moveable bits, represent the Mysteries/Sacraments....

WHY , and what are we supposed to do with these 7 moveable bits ?

Anhelyna who does not like mysteries

Dearest Anhelyna!

Yes, those seven moveable pieces are a way of counting seven hundred Jesus Prayers on the lestovka i.e. marking each hundred set.

The "minimum" prayer rule of the Old Believers is that 700 Jesus Prayers be said daily.

They also often add another 300 with one hundred for an invocation to the Guardian Angel (Angel of Christ, my Guardian, save me thy sinful servant - the ONLY other time I've ever seen the word "save" applied to a Saint other than the Most Holy Mother of God), another hundred to St John the Baptist, the Administrator's namesake, and another to the Mother of God.

Greek prayer ropes often have a small leather string attached near the tassel where there are ten moveable beads so as to keep count of the hundreds of Prayers one prays. One could keep count of the hundreds using a pencil and paper, an abacus or by placing small stones into a bowl - a form of counting also employed in the Thebaid (St Paul of Thebes carried 300 pebbles in one pouch he carried on one shoulder and as he prayed his 300 daily prayers, he placed them, pebble by pebble, into another empty pouch on his other shoulder until all 300 were moved from one pouch to the other . . .).

I have a ring with two thick strings (from Tibet) with ten moveable metal beads each. The ring fits over a finger and as one prays 100 Jesus prayers on the Lestovka, one simply keeps count by pulling down a bead until all ten beads on one string have been pulled down.

Then one pulls a bead from the other string to mark that one has done one thousand . . .

Alex

Now THAT is beginning to make sense - I had this wee thing in the back of my mind that they could be used as a counting device - but I wasn't sure how.

Now just for you and wildly off topic I fear - but I've obviously got your attention - which e-mail addy can I use ? need to chat with you - PM me the answer please is it the @r.....Dot c... ??

These folk who have PMs disabled :p